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Thread: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by OKgrannie View Post
    It's disingenuous to "rename" the embryo "an innocent baby".
    No, no, no...You have that exactly backwards...What is that growing inside the woman's womb? is it a toaster? is it an eggplant? is it a puppy? NO! It is a human child from beginning to end. The only disingenuous renaming going on here is the purposeful choice of the pro abortion crowd to rename what it is to ease their guilt in killing it.

    It's not dismissive to recognize the differences in embryos and babies, and to recognize that at some stage the human acquires a value to society that it did not have earlier.
    Sure it is, dismissive of the life growing within you. It is such a disregard that it becomes disgusting, and perverse. Just as here you say that the bench mark is value to society, just as other tyrants throughout history have used that language to exterminate millions of people. History judged them evil, what saves you?

    Neither is it dismissive to recognize the price a woman pays to bring a new life into the world, and to grant her the respect of allowing her deciding if it is worth the cost to her.
    What a gift women have. Being able to carry, and birth the child, as well as the bond that goes with motherhood is something to admire for sure. What women have is special, not a curse. Women do have my respect in that choice, I just believe it should be made at the point of creation, not an afterthought because of irresponsible behavior.

    Your thought sound awfully close to this...

    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    You say you are against having to pay for be mistakes of others and you are against abortion. What do you think happens when the woman is forced to give birth and then goes on welfare to support the child. You are paying for her mistakes. You can't have it both ways.
    Nothing is perfect, but I prefer not to kill defenseless innocent children in the womb. Tell me TNE, are you on board with clubbing baby seals also? If not why not? Same thing.....
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by OKgrannie View Post
    It's not just hard, it's impossible. A woman's body is damaged permanently from pregnancy/childbirth. Every woman may not get ALL of this list of permanent effects, but every woman will get some.
    So go have your tubes tied then and NEVER have children. You obviously resent them.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Well, at least something good is finally coming out of that state. it as 0-2 with WallyWorld and Slick Willy....

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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    No, no, no...You have that exactly backwards...What is that growing inside the woman's womb? is it a toaster? is it an eggplant? is it a puppy? NO! It is a human child from beginning to end. The only disingenuous renaming going on here is the purposeful choice of the pro abortion crowd to rename what it is to ease their guilt in killing it.
    It is a zygote/embryo/fetus. Referring to it as a baby is an emotional appeal fallacy. Babyhood is from birth to one year of age, childhood is from birth to adulthood. Stretching those definitions to include zefs is an emotional appeal.


    Sure it is, dismissive of the life growing within you. It is such a disregard that it becomes disgusting, and perverse. Just as here you say that the bench mark is value to society, just as other tyrants throughout history have used that language to exterminate millions of people. History judged them evil, what saves you?
    Value to society is one consideration in making law. Attempts to use the force of government to enforce religious or moral views is evil. History is now being made about the evil of laws suppressing gays and lesbians. I have not been judged by history because although I am old enough to remember a lot of history, I am still in the here and now.



    What a gift women have. Being able to carry, and birth the child, as well as the bond that goes with motherhood is something to admire for sure. What women have is special, not a curse. Women do have my respect in that choice, I just believe it should be made at the point of creation, not an afterthought because of irresponsible behavior.
    If the woman doesn't want it, it's not a gift, it's a burden. If the woman does want it, there's no more precious gift. There's nothing particularly special about being women, approximately half of all people are. Responsible women have unplanned pregnancies too, you know. Approximately half of all women seeking abortions had been using birth control. Now here is where you tell me she shouldn't have had sex at all. Heard that one before.
    "Though no one can go back and make a brand new start, anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending."
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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So go have your tubes tied then and NEVER have children. You obviously resent them.
    Tying your tubes, or tubal ligation, or vasectomy for men are good options for those who already have all the children they want, but they're considered permanent so one should not undertake such a procedure lightly. And they are not perfect either. Both procedures have been known to fail. Then what? You gonna allow the woman an abortion then?
    "Though no one can go back and make a brand new start, anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending."
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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Nothing is perfect, but I prefer not to kill defenseless innocent children in the womb. Tell me TNE, are you on board with clubbing baby seals also? If not why not? Same thing.....
    Tsk, tsk, tsk, appeal to emotion all over the place.
    "Though no one can go back and make a brand new start, anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending."
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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Nothing is perfect, but I prefer not to kill defenseless innocent children in the womb. Tell me TNE, are you on board with clubbing baby seals also? If not why not? Same thing.....
    Lol what an appeal to emotion. So here is one right back at you. I suppose you agree babes from rape are a gift from god. If not why? In either pregnancies the fetus is innocent.

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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by OKgrannie View Post
    It's disingenuous to "rename" the embryo "an innocent baby".
    It's innocence could not be more complete.
    It's not dismissive to recognize the differences in embryos and babies, and to recognize that at some stage the human acquires a value to society that it did not have earlier.
    That seems to be the next east step and follow up argument for the pro-abortionists. Deciding when and whose life is more valuable to 'society' is just around the corner. It seems you've inherited the philosophies of Margaret Sanger and Planned Parenthood ( among others) on Eugenics in seeking to create a better society. Who lives and who dies may become a real issue in the coming years given that public debt is in the tens of trillions, the population is aging, there is not enough young people to pay the taxes necessary for the older members of society, or those who are otherwise not contributing their 'fair share'.

    Neither is it dismissive to recognize the price a woman pays to bring a new life into the world, and to grant her the respect of allowing her deciding if it is worth the cost to her.
    It is her body, her decision, and her choice to behave irresponsibly. Men no longer play the role they once did and are now largely irresponsible. And why not? We cannot change the role of one gender and not have this reflected in the other. That is the world we've created and which the next generation, though 55 million short, will inherit.

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    re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by OKgrannie View Post
    Tsk, tsk, tsk, appeal to emotion all over the place.
    Protests are often held in front of prisons when a person is about to be executed, and emotions run quite high. Those who do the protesting often make the claim that it is state sanctioned murder. We should not be surprised when emotions run high when a life is being taken, even if one life is guilty of murder, and the other life is innocent of any crime.

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