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Thread: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    But everyone generally refers to this bit of life as a baby, right?
    It's not a life. Those who WANT the child may refer to their baby and have baby showers, but it's still more like a parasite feeding off the mother. If they mother is in a car wreck and dies, the baby would die. It is dependent on the LIFE of the mother.
    Alex Carey:

    ... the 20th century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: The growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy.

    Australian social scientist, quoted by Noam Chomsky in World Orders Old and New

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    I'm confused. First you said
    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy Creek View Post
    It's not a life.
    Then you said
    If they mother is in a car wreck and dies, the baby would die.
    So you are saying that it is a baby and it is alive.

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy Creek View Post
    It's not a life. Those who WANT the child may refer to their baby and have baby showers, but it's still more like a parasite feeding off the mother. If they mother is in a car wreck and dies, the baby would die. It is dependent on the LIFE of the mother.
    It's not a life?? Of course it is.

    In fact you go on to say that it would die apart from its mother. How can it die if it is not a life??

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Pilot View Post
    I'm confused. First you said


    Then you said
    The "baby" term is used if the mother wants the ZEF to go through the Gestation period. WANTING the ZEF to become a baby does not make the ZEF a baby....it is a ZEF and dies if the mother is in a car wreck. I was only referring to the ZEF as a baby to emphasize the fact that a woman wanting a baby does not have it in the gestation period, as if she dies, the ZEF dies and does not go to birth to become a baby outside the womb.
    Alex Carey:

    ... the 20th century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: The growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy.

    Australian social scientist, quoted by Noam Chomsky in World Orders Old and New

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    It's not a life?? Of course it is.

    In fact you go on to say that it would die apart from its mother. How can it die if it is not a life??
    No, it is dependent on the life of the mother. The life dies, the ZEF dies. It is a live, but not a life
    Alex Carey:

    ... the 20th century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: The growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy.

    Australian social scientist, quoted by Noam Chomsky in World Orders Old and New

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Pilot View Post
    I'm confused. First you said


    Then you said


    So you are saying that it is a baby and it is alive.
    These are the illogical machinations these people must go through in order to justify their positions. It makes no sense at all.

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy Creek View Post
    No, it is dependent on the life of the mother. The life dies, the ZEF dies. It is a live, but not a life
    It is alive but not living.

    And you see no contradiction here?

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    It is alive but not living.

    And you see no contradiction here?
    It is alive, but not a life. Nope. Do you see the contradiction in calling a zygote, embryo and fetus a baby? Or a life?
    Alex Carey:

    ... the 20th century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: The growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy.

    Australian social scientist, quoted by Noam Chomsky in World Orders Old and New

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy Creek View Post
    It is alive, but not a life. Nope. Do you see the contradiction in calling a zygote, embryo and fetus a baby? Or a life?
    We do not generally refer to babies in these terms. We call them babies.

    But you don't feel comfortable calling them babies, or even alive, because that suggests something immoral is going on, the taking of a babies life.

    So you use the terms zygote, embryo and fetus in order to downplay the fact that you are taking a life.

    But call it what you will, it's still taking a life and it is terribly hard to justify such an act. It is hugely immoral, and some would say evil.

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    Re: Arkansas to ban abortion at 12 weeks, earliest in nation [W:1036:1154]

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    We do not generally refer to babies in these terms. We call them babies.

    But you don't feel comfortable calling them babies, or even alive, because that suggests something immoral is going on, the taking of a babies life.

    So you use the terms zygote, embryo and fetus in order to downplay the fact that you are taking a life.

    But call it what you will, it's still taking a life and it is terribly hard to justify such an act. It is hugely immoral, and some would say evil.
    No, there's nothing immoral in an abortion. Even with the bible.

    God's Not Pro-Life

    Hosea 9:11-16 Hosea prays for God’s intervention. “Ephraim shall bring forth his children to the murderer. Give them, 0 Lord: what wilt thou give? Give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts. . .Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit: yea though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb.” Clearly Hosea desires that the people of Ephraim can no longer have children. God of course obeys by making all their unborn children miscarry. Is not terminating a pregnancy unnaturally “abortion”?

    Numbers 5:11-21 The description of a bizarre, brutal and abusive ritual to be performed on a wife SUSPECTED of adultery. This is considered to be an induced abortion to rid a woman of another man’s child.

    Numbers 31:17 (Moses) “Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every women that hath known man by lying with him.” In other words: women that might be pregnant, which clearly is abortion for the fetus.

    Hosea 13:16 God promises to dash to pieces the infants of Samaria and the “their women with child shall be ripped up”. Once again this god kills the unborn, including their pregnant mothers.

    2 Kings 15:16 God allows the pregnant women of Tappuah (aka Tiphsah) to be “ripped open”. And the Christians have the audacity to say god is pro-life. How and the hell is it that Christians can read passages where God allows pregnant women to be murdered, yet still claim abortion is wrong?
    God was for abortion and did not obviously consider it life. Christ never spoke out against it. If it were immoral, Christ would have labeled it so.
    Alex Carey:

    ... the 20th century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: The growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy.

    Australian social scientist, quoted by Noam Chomsky in World Orders Old and New

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