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Thread: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    The left dont do the "hate" card nearly as much as the right.. it is the whole basis of right wing ideology.. conflict and strife.
    Only when it comes to immigration, then the left play it to extremes. "Racist Racist"
    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Freedom cannot be brought by foreigners with a gun.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    The idiots on this board that fully take the republican or democrat side and think their party is the harbingers of truth and justice and the other, evil scum who are ruining the country. When you realize they're both the latter, you have reached enlightenment.

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by Spriggs05 View Post
    Only when it comes to immigration, then the left play it to extremes. "Racist Racist"
    And while they do "play on it" as you say, the right has to admit that some to a lot of their rhetoric and policies are at best borderline racist when it comes to illegal immigration... you (no offense... dont think you meant too) just did a classic... forgot the "illegal" part in front of immigration, and turned your whole comment into a nationalistic right wing fascist comment being promoted by the far right for decades and that of course means the left will jump on it and call "racist racist".. even though it most likely was a typo in your case.
    PeteEU

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    The left dont do the "hate" card nearly as much as the right.. it is the whole basis of right wing ideology.. conflict and strife. Now that aint saying that left wingers have not used the boogieman excuse to gain or maintain power... hell Chavez did it, but compared to the right it is relatively minimal.
    What a remarkable statement. The whole basis of right wing ideology is hate, conflict and strife?

    Something tells me you might be just a wee bit off in your assessement.

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    And while they do "play on it" as you say, the right has to admit that some to a lot of their rhetoric and policies are at best borderline racist when it comes to illegal immigration... you (no offense... dont think you meant too) just did a classic... forgot the "illegal" part in front of immigration, and turned your whole comment into a nationalistic right wing fascist comment being promoted by the far right for decades and that of course means the left will jump on it and call "racist racist".. even though it most likely was a typo in your case.
    No i meant the right wants to restrict all forms of immigration but seriously that was a mistake yes. Some are however there are some that have been mis-interperated such as enoch powells "rivers of blood" speech, what he meant was that there will eventually be so many immigrants that inter racial conflict will be inevitable so gradually cut down on it, however it was interperated as "CUT ALL IMMIGRATION NOW" and hence the British right has constantly been labeld racist.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Freedom cannot be brought by foreigners with a gun.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    The idiots on this board that fully take the republican or democrat side and think their party is the harbingers of truth and justice and the other, evil scum who are ruining the country. When you realize they're both the latter, you have reached enlightenment.

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by RGacky3 View Post
    Thats nonsense.

    Attachment 67143884Attachment 67143885Attachment 67143886Attachment 67143887
    Investment and GDP Growth in Venezuela | venezuelanalysis.com

    Manufacturing has increased, as has trade, as has capital formation.

    I'd like to see the piece by Rueters.
    I have no idea what source you are using or how they got their numbers. But I am going to go with the data from the World Bank and OECD that says that capital investment peaked at 24.5% (not 31.9%) in 2007, and has declined to ~18% in 2011. The year 1998 saw gross capital formation at 28.6%, while it never went above 24.5% in any year afterwards.
    It is also important to not that most of this investment is the result of oil money dictated by the government, rather than actual organic growth. Perhaps you haven't noticed, but economic growth in Venezuela has been lock in step with increases in oil prices. The poor economic performance before Chavez was directly the result of low oil prices, and the average (for similar countries in the region) growth after Chavez has been the result of surges in oil prices (much of which was lobbied for by Chavez). See figure 1 and figure 9. Considering the boom in natural gas and declining exports of oil to the U.S., much of that lobbying power to fix high prices is going to take a nose dive, and the Venezuelan economy with it.

    If you consider abandoned half constructed buildings as a boom in construction, then perhaps they are doing well in that sector.


    I think what is far more telling, is the rapid decline of non-oil exports which are at 60 year lows in dollar amounts (not %), rising imports, as well as dogging shortages in housing, basic food staples, and pharmaceuticals are much better reflections of the result of Venezuelan economic policy under Chavez.


    I won't repeat other points I've already made on this thread so I'll just refer you to post #157.

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    What a remarkable statement. The whole basis of right wing ideology is hate, conflict and strife?

    Something tells me you might be just a wee bit off in your assessement.
    Am I? You might want to look at the policies and rhetoric coming out of the right......

    Obama is a Muslim.... aint that playing to fears and hatred?
    Obama is a socialist... aint that playing to fears and hatred?

    Are the two above solely used to create conflict between left and right?

    Another example... refusing to compromise... the party of NO... is that not confrontational?

    And I am not saying the left are angels, but compared to the right... come on.
    PeteEU

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by Spriggs05 View Post
    No i meant the right wants to restrict all forms of immigration but seriously that was a mistake yes. Some are however there are some that have been mis-interperated such as enoch powells "rivers of blood" speech, what he meant was that there will eventually be so many immigrants that inter racial conflict will be inevitable so gradually cut down on it, however it was interperated as "CUT ALL IMMIGRATION NOW" and hence the British right has constantly been labeld racist.
    Yep, but why make it easy for the left? And often it is hard to tell the difference between a verbal mistake and an actual opinion.
    PeteEU

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Am I? You might want to look at the policies and rhetoric coming out of the right......

    Obama is a Muslim.... aint that playing to fears and hatred?
    Obama is a socialist... aint that playing to fears and hatred?

    Are the two above solely used to create conflict between left and right?

    Another example... refusing to compromise... the party of NO... is that not confrontational?

    And I am not saying the left are angels, but compared to the right... come on.

    And you use the above points to conclude the whole basis of right wing ideology is hate, conflict and strife?

    I think you are demonstrating that of which you seek to promote.

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    The left dont do the "hate" card nearly as much as the right.. it is the whole basis of right wing ideology.. conflict and strife. Now that aint saying that left wingers have not used the boogieman excuse to gain or maintain power... hell Chavez did it, but compared to the right it is relatively minimal.
    The "hate card" is a staple of the "left."

    All the left does is fashion themselves as a bunch of victims of the "big bad wolf." Hell, progressives create the language used to play victim.

    Who uses the language: "The war on __________" or "anti-_________."

    I'm not a republican but I can say I have never seen republicans use "hate" and attempt to twist it into sympathy.

    To progressives there are only two types of positions on issues - hate and obedience.

    A perfect example is the fact I'm pro-life, now democrats take that to mean I hate woman and I'm perpetuating an alleged war on woman... So democrats automatically hate me for that and attempt to portray me as a toothless southern redneck t bagger.

    See how that works?

    I'm pro-capitalism, pro-business and pro-right to work, what's the progressive response to that? "the Kotch brothers bought you off."

    Another good example - I realize crime rates are higher in urban minority neighborhoods - that makes me a racist in their book.

    I strongly defend the Second Amendment - to a progressive that means I want to see babies die, not only that but I must be an uneducated southern hillbilly.

    Those are just several examples of how progressives use their hate and attempt to justify it.

    Progressives are hateful people...

    I cant say I have ever seen a conservative pull that "hate" nonsense. Conservatives have their flaws but they don't resort to playground bully tactics unless they're trying to degrade us libertarians.

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Progressives are hateful people...
    For many of the so called 'Progressives' that is the sum total of where they are progressing to.
    There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences.
    P. J. O'Rourke

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