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Thread: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

  1. #91
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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    Of course. Most other South American nations have protections for minorities, and they honor them. If you seek to excuse Chavez on the basis that 'everybody does it' them I'm afraid it falls flat.

    The evidence that Chavez actually improved things for the poor is pretty thin. What he did do was create a climate of fear in which the murder rate is higher than any nation on earth and reaches levels comparable to a war zone in Caracas (200 killed per 100,000 per year). He took control of the Supreme Court, expanding and packing it, and packed government service with his own supporters as well. His supporters repeatedly violated election laws with the acquiescence of the authorities in 2012.

    Freedom of speech has been gone from Venezuela for years now. Media is restricted and critical coverage is blocked. Chavez's regime seized not only television and radio stations, but also banks, oil facilities, cement plants, food factories, sugar plantations, and much else. Much of the proceeds went into Chavez's own pocket -- he was worth between $1 and 2 billion at his death.

    Meanwhile, plagued by high inflation, food shortages, power outages, and mounting debt, Venezuela has become one of the most economically dysfunctional nations in the Western Hemisphere. It is difficult if not impossible for anyone, let alone the poor, to find prosperity under such conditions.

    I'll be darned. Those are the same things I have heard on AP, ABC, FOX, CBS, etc. I wonder if the perspective is adjustable to confront reality.

  2. #92
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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    I'll be darned. Those are the same things I have heard on AP, ABC, FOX, CBS, etc. I wonder if the perspective is adjustable to confront reality.
    Here it is from the New York Times, written by a writer from the UK Guardian:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/06/op...ewanted=2&_r=0

    "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule." --HL Mencken

  3. #93
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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post
    Just got an update form the VP to my phone saying the VP of Venezuela has announced that Hugo Chavez has died.
    Articles and link to come soon.

    RIP Hugo Chavez. You were a great president and a great leader of Venezuela and did many great things for your country.
    And for some reason the world seems a little brighter today.

  4. #94
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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Wasn't the Venezuelan media pushing propaganda that Chavez was fine?

    I wonder if the cancer did him in.
    I bet it was Colonel Mustard in the kitchen.

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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by Bonzai View Post
    Another person who's never been to Venezuela............................

    When did you last visit?

    Also, I like this post from the CNN article announcing Chavez had died:

    Rest in peace, Hugo Rafael Chávez Frías. As a Venezuelan, I didn't agree with most of your policies and politics, but I do not rejoice in your death and I do respect the pain of your family and supporters.

    In 1998, when you campaigned for the presidency -and promised to end corruption- despite my disappointment with the traditional parties, I did not support you because you had led a coup against president Carlos Andres Pérez. I didn't like Pérez, but he was elected by our people and attempting to overthrow him was proof that you did not respect the will of Venezuelans.

    I didn't oppose 100% of what you did. I was grateful, for example, that you placed the issue of poverty on the table and you put the spotlight on millions of Venezuelans that until then had been excluded. I knew that the Cuban doctors in the slums were unprepared and unequipped, but I understood that they meant the world to the mother that knocks on their door at 3am. I was also happy of the way most Venezuelans started to care about politics again (some because they supported you; others because they opposed you). The anti-politic feeling we saw in the 90's was precisely what got you elected. And I also kept in mind that a majority of Venezuelans did support you, so you certainly had a right to be in office.

    These are my 10 reasons why I will not miss you:

    1) Your authoritarian manner (which reflected a flaw probably most Venezuelans have), and your inability to engage in an honest dialogue with anyone that opposed you. Even from your death bed, you had a Supreme Court justice fired because she didn't agree with your politics.

    2) Your disrespect for the rule of law and your contribution to a climate of impunity in Venezuela. In 1999, you re-wrote the Constitution to fit your needs, and yet you violated it almost on a daily basis. With this example, it is no surprise that crime exploded in Venezuela. In 14 years, our homicide rate more than tripled from 22/100K to 74/100K. While judges were busy trying to prove their political allegiance to you, only 11% of homicides led to a conviction.

    3) Your empty promises and the way you manipulated many Venezuelans to think you were really working for them. In 14 years you built less public housing than any president before you did in their 5 year periods. Hospitals today have no resources, and if you go there in emergency you must everything from medicines to surgical gloves and masks. The truth is that you were better at blowing your own trumpet than at getting things done.

    4) The astounding level of corruption of your government. There was corruption before you got elected, but normally a government's scandals weren't made public until they handed power to the opposing party. Now we've heard about millions and millions of dollars vanishing in front of everybody's eyes, and your only reaction was to attack the media that revealed the corruption. The only politicians accused of corruption have been from parties that oppose you, and mostly on trumped up charges. For example, Leopoldo Lopez was never condemned by the courts but you still prevented him for running for office. His crime? Using money from the wrong budget allocation to pay for the salaries of teachers and firemen -because your government withheld the appropriate funds.

    5) The opportunities you missed. When you took office, the price of oil was $9.30, and in 2008 it reached $126.33. There was so much good you could have done with that money! And yet you decided to throw it away on corruption and buying elections and weapons. If you had used these resources well, 10.7% of Venezuelans would not be in extreme poverty.

    6) Your attacks on private property and entrepreneurship. You nationalized hundreds of private companies, and pushed hundreds more towards bankruptcy. Not because you were a communist or a socialist, but simply because you wanted no one left with any power to oppose you. If everyone was a public employee, you could force them to attend your political rallies, and the opposition would not get any funding.

    7) Your hypocrisy on freedom and human rights. You shut down more than 30 radio and television stations for being critical of your government, you denied access to foreign currency for newspapers to buy printing paper (regular citizens can't access foreign currency unless you authorize it), you imprisoned people without trial for years, you imprisoned people for crimes of opinion, you fired tens of thousands of public employees for signing a petition for a recall referendum and you denied them access to public services and even ID cards and passports.

    8) Your hypocrisy on the issue of Venezuela's sovereignty. You kicked out the Americans but then you pulled down your pants for the Cubans, Russians, Chinese and Iranians. We have Cuban officers giving orders in the Venezuelan army. Chinese oil companies work with a higher margin of profit than any Western companies did. And you made it clear that your alliances would be with governments that massacre their own people.

    9) Your hypocrisy on the issue of violence. You said this was a peaceful revolution but you allowed illegal armed groups like Tupamaros, La Piedrita and FBLN to operate. You gave them weapons. You had the Russians set up a Kalashnikov plant in Venezuela. You were critical of American wars but yet you gave weapons to the Colombian guerrilla, whose only agenda is murder and drug-dealing.

    10) Your hypocrisy on democracy. Your favorite insult for the opposition parties in Venezuela was "coupists", but you forgot you organized a coup in 1992, and the military that was loyal to you suggested they would support a coup in your favor if the opposition ever won the presidential elections. There was no democracy in your political party: you chose each of the candidates for the National Assembly and for city and state governments. When the opposition won the referendum that would have allowed you to change the Constitution in 2007, you disavowed the results and you figured out a way to change the articles and allow yourself to be reelected as many times as you wanted. You manipulated the elections in 2010 to make sure the opposition didn't get more than a third of seats in Parliament even though they got 51% of the popular vote. Your democracy was made of paper, you made sure there were no meaningful checks and balances and all institutions were your puppets.

    So no, Hugo I will not miss you. Rest in peace now, while we try to rebuild the mess of a country that you left us.

  6. #96
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    We lost Chavez

    but the world will never forget that great leader.......





    Venezuela's President Hugo Chavez has died aged 58, after 14 years in power.

    Mr Chavez had been seriously ill with cancer for more than a year, undergoing several operations in Cuba.

    Crowds of supporters gathered outside the Caracas hospital where he died, chanting "We are all Chavez!"

    A self-proclaimed revolutionary, Hugo Chavez was a controversial figure in Venezuela and on the world stage. A staunch critic of the US, he inspired a left-wing revival across Latin America.

    The government of Cuba declared three days of national mourning. In a statement read out on state television, it said Mr Chavez had "stood by Fidel [Castro] like a true son", referring to Cuba's former president, who stepped down in 2006 due to ill-health.

    In Argentina, President Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner, a close friend, suspended all activities after the death was announced.

    Peru's Congress held a minute of silence in his honour while Bolivia's President Evo Morales said he was leaving immediately for Caracas.

    The Ecuadorian government said it felt the loss as its own, and hoped its neighbours could carry on Mr Chavez's revolution.




    BBC News - Iconic Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez dies
    "Sovereignty is not given, it is taken." ATATÜRK

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    Re: We lost Chavez

    sometimes its good to lose something

  8. #98
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    Re: AP: VP of Venezuela Has Announced Hugo Chavez has Died

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    I am sorry for the person Chavez, for his family and loved ones and for the people who supported him as president. As a citizen of the world I am not sad that president Chavez has passed. He was too extreme in a lot of his actions and his beliefs.
    as extreme as capitalism
    "Sovereignty is not given, it is taken." ATATÜRK

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    Re: We lost Chavez

    Quote Originally Posted by Travis007 View Post
    sometimes its good to lose something
    we shouldnt be happy with death

    in fact such leaders keep living in hearts
    "Sovereignty is not given, it is taken." ATATÜRK

  10. #100
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    Re: We lost Chavez

    If he were such a great leader why did he have to go to Cuba to get the cancer treatment? One would think a great leader would have facilities in his own country that could adequately treat something as common as cancer..........

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