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Thread: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Since the woman died at the hospital, she didn't even need CPR. So the 911 operator could have just been giving incompetent and even life threatening advice/demands.

    Not everyone who collapses needs CPR.
    Don't know how you reached the conclusion "she didn't even need CPR" - first responders performed CPR on her when they arrived. As the other article states, "If the nurse would have provided CPR to 87-year-old Lorraine Bayless, Lorraine might have had some broken ribs but she would most likely still be alive."

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    some people have no heart
    Since the article states she died later at the hospital, she didn't need CPR and doing so on an 86 year old woman who didn't need it could have been lethal on it's own. Pounding and pressing on the chest of someone that old can break ribs pressing them into lungs and heart.

    This appears an opportunity for the media to create some OMG RAGE! crap before knowing the facts - and sadly too many people go along with it.

    Here is what appears the real story.
    1. An 86 year old woman collapsed.
    2. Per policy, a staffer promptly called 911
    3. A 911 telephone receptionist - with NO medical license - decided to play doctor and tried to get the staffer to be her nurse, for which the nurse refused.
    4. The woman was transported to the hospital, still alive, meaning CPR was fully not necessary and would have been harmful or lethal.

    IF those are the facts, then ABC and those raging along with that for-profit corporation (that makes money by making attention getters) are 100% wrong factually (and therefore also otherwise.)

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    4. The woman was transported to the hospital, still alive, meaning CPR was fully not necessary and would have been harmful or lethal.
    What the $#&*(@ are you talking about? Is it your position that CPR should only be performed on dead people?

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    It even has this in the article - that people now rage about:

    At the beginning of the Feb. 26 call, the nurse asked for paramedics to come and help the woman who had collapsed and was barely breathing, according to a transcript of the call.


    You do NOT do CPR on someone who is breathing! Even if "barely" breathing. At the most, you give that person oxygen and maybe a blood thinner - not start pounding and pumping on the person's chest!!! And get the person to the hospital ASAP.

    Don't you people know that?!

    In REAL terms, the 911 operator was telling that nurse: "KILL HER! KILL HER! AND IF YOU WON'T, FIND ANYONE WHO WILL! KILLING HER IS THE ONLY DECENT THING TO DO!!!"
    Last edited by joko104; 03-04-13 at 04:54 PM.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    The only reason this is in the news is to give the public a baseline of fear that a lack of medical care will kill innocent people and therefore WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING!!

    Lots of elderly die every day. Lots of elderly could have been saved but have DNRs in place. This literally happens all the time. The only difference here is that this incident had a good 911 call for us to hear.

    Calm down people, there's nothing to see here, move along.
    that woman's age is not an excuse to ignore this news . and it is the duty of media to make people aware what kind of problems the others have been experiencing in that society



    social justice is for everyone , not everybody has the same opportunities as the others in this life.not everybody can buy health insurance .
    "Sovereignty is not given, it is taken." ATATÜRK

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    -- 2. Per policy, a staffer promptly called 911
    3. A 911 telephone receptionist - with NO medical license - decided to play doctor and tried to get the staffer to be her nurse, for which the nurse refused.
    Bakersfield Fire Battalion Chief Anthony Galagaza said Halvorson followed protocol and that dispatchers give CPR instructions over the phone numerous times each year. LATimes Blog
    Sad story, I agree CPR on an 86 year old could break ribs but it equally can do on a baby that needs CPR. Ribs can be treated, death cannot.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    The possible lack of alarm by the nurse is because people who work in old age homes come accustomed to seeing old folks have medical crisis and pass away too. Experienced paramedics also come to act and make decisions without emotional drama.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    It even has this in the article - that people now rage about:

    At the beginning of the Feb. 26 call, the nurse asked for paramedics to come and help the woman who had collapsed and was barely breathing, according to a transcript of the call.


    You do NOT do CPR on someone who is breathing! Even if "barely" breathing. At the most, you give that person oxygen and maybe a blood thinner - not start pounding and pumping on the person's chest!!! And get the person to the hospital ASAP.

    Don't you people know that?!

    In REAL terms, the 911 operator was telling that nurse: "KILL HER! KILL HER! AND IF YOU WON'T, FIND ANYONE WHO WILL! KILLING HER IS THE ONLY DECENT THING TO DO!!!"
    Without the CPR she was going to die. That much is clear, and proven at this point. CPR may have saved her, or it may have been pointless. We do know that it would not have resulted in more death. If you are in a position to save a life, even if it's a small chance, you should do it. I am not saying she should be legally required, or even have her license suspended if she doesnt. But as a human being, if you have an opportunity to save a life you should do it. As a nurse who is trained at the very least in CPR and you just watch someone die because you are scared of losing your job or a lawsuit then you are just a ****ty person. If as an employer you put your companies profits above human life you are a ****ty person.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    that woman's age is not an excuse to ignore this news . and it is the duty of media to make people aware what kind of problems the others have been experiencing in that society



    social justice is for everyone , not everybody has the same opportunities as the others in this life.not everybody can buy health insurance .
    When a person learns facts, they should adjust their reasoning.

    The story says the woman was still breathing. That she died later in the hospital. Accordingly, CPR would NOT have helped in any way and only poised potential to harm or kill the woman. You NEVER do CPR on someone who is breathing for MANY reasons.

    For example, difficulty breathing could be the result of some obstruction (such as food) restricting breathing. Blowing into a person's mouth is exactly what NOT to do as it pushes the obstruction deeper and can cause total blockage - and DEATH. A person "barely breathing" is NO indication of ANY heart problem whatsoever! Doing CPR on someone having difficulty breathing would make less sense than putting a bandage on the person's leg - other than putting a bandage on the person's leg wouldn't harm the person.

    The media got it wrong, as did the 911 operator. NEVER, EVER, EVER do CPR (chest or mouth-to-mouth) on someone "barely breathing." That can ONLY do harm or cause death.

    As Jerry stated, there is no story here. Move on.

    Nice little lecture you have about "social justice" anyway.
    Last edited by joko104; 03-04-13 at 05:06 PM.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    CPR in the field is indicated ONLY if the patient has stopped breathing. A 911 operator should not be dispensing or suggesting medical treatment. Had the staffer started CPR as per the operator's instructions and the patient had died then because of it, the operator should be on the hook for negligence.

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