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Thread: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by muciti View Post
    Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR | News - Home


    This is the sad state our country is in. It is a messed up situation but this woman/her employer are right that they could have been sued and probably would have lost if they had intervened. The woman, and everyone else around there, should be ashamed of themselves none the less.
    This was the understanding my family had when we moved my grandmother into a home with advanced Alzheimer's. Were she resuscitated after an episode that would have only prolonged her suffering.

    The woman's caretakers knew and would have had to specifically agree to the DNR policy when they moved this woman into one of these homes. It was no secret. This is what the family wanted.

    It's good that the nurse followed the policy, as this was the wish of the family.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by Fisher View Post
    There still are and they are state laws. I am not sure a nurse would actually be able to avail themselves of it though since the profession has a standard of practices separate from just what the law alone says. I think at the very least the nurses license should be suspended.
    Why should her license be suspended? She did not violate any doctor's order.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    This was the understanding my family had when we moved my grandmother into a home with advanced Alzheimers. Were she appreciated after an episode that would have only prolonged her suffering.

    The woman's caretakers knew and would have had to specifically agree to the DNR policy when they moved this woman into one of these homes. It was no secret. This is what the family wanted. Who are you to judge that?

    Well, according to some members of the forum, a 911 operator's opinion supercedes all contracts, laws and personal choices. Whatever a 911 operator tell you to do, you must do so immediately and if you go to prison for doing so, well that also is your civic duty - or so some on this forum think. In their opinion, NO ONE has any right to a DNR agreement. A right to life no matter what thing I guess. And anyone who doesn't agree and proactively do everything to oppose DNR agreements is a murderer.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by Pilot View Post
    Isn't she and/or the employer much more likely to be sued for not trying CPR? They stood by and watched in defiance of the instructions of the 911 operator and basic medical training.
    It's my understanding that only "first responders" ie LEOs, paramedics and nurses, etc, have a duty to treat anyone. Even CNAs reserve the right to refuse to treat, just as you and I do.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    911 operators are telephone receptionists and nothing else. They have no authority and nothing they say offers any protection.

    Setting aside an DNR agreement, CPR on an 86 year old woman could easily be lethal. Show me medical material that CPR in that situation was correct. Was the 911 operator a licensed doctor? Seems you think so.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    911 operators are telephone receptionists and nothing else. They have no authority and nothing they say offers any protection.

    Setting aside an DNR agreement, CPR on an 86 year old woman could easily be lethal. Show me medical material that CPR in that situation was correct. Was the 911 operator a licensed doctor? Seems you think so.
    True, but with a sympathetic jury, I could see the non-action lawsuit being worse than attempting but failing.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by Pilot View Post
    True, but with a sympathetic jury, I could see the non-action lawsuit being worse than attempting but failing.
    Not if there was a Do Not Revive statement that had been signed by that 86 year old woman. It also will depend on the care contract. If the law would not allow a judgement for those or other reasons, a judge would not let it go to a jury.

    The legality is that juries determine facts, but judges determine law. If "law" does not allow a judgment on undisputed facts, then the jury does not get to decide the case. The case has to make a prima facie (on it's face) case before a defense is offered, or the judge is to dismiss the case as a matter of law.
    Last edited by joko104; 03-04-13 at 04:36 PM.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    It depends on the quality of life the woman had to bring her back to. If she had a DNR and indicated she was suffering without hope or was in a semi vegetative state, then we aren't qualified from a distance to have made that judgement. It shows a lack of compassion to force someone to exist in misery, when nature is ready for them to have peace.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Why should her license be suspended? She did not violate any doctor's order.
    Following doctor's orders or her employment policies are not the only duties a nurse is subject to. Her license is predicated on another set of rules. If she were walking down the street, she could have just kept on walking by. She was not. She was in an employment setting as a nurse and quite frankly interfered with the 911 operators efforts to get someone on the telephone who would try to save the woman's life.

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    Re: Calif. woman dies after nurse refuses to perform CPR

    Quote Originally Posted by Pilot View Post
    Valid point, but I would think she would have relayed that information to the dispatcher, especially after they became adamant that she try CPR.
    Yes, I agree that it is bizare to call 911 when there is no intention of providing care for this woman. Who else do you call if someone is dying though? The body does need to be taken away.

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