• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

SOTU Address:[W: 378; 1310; 1451]

Eighty Deuce said:
Taxpayers being on the hook is a seperate issue from the repeal of Glass Steagle. I am all for allowing failure to fail. It is the liberals who are not. See GM/Chrysler if you doubt me. I am more than OK with the creative destruction of capital. . ;)
Click to expand...

Burn the village to save it huh? Sounds nice unless you're the one caught in the destruction.
 
Re: SOTU Address:

Conservative said:
This President has the worst economic record coming off a recession in modern history. He lacks leaderership skills as do his supporters. You really need to get over your Bush Derangement Syndrome and accept the fact that Obama is a disaster, lacking the qualifications for the job, and someone who tells you what you want to hear. Always blaming someone else for his own failures. You have no idea what leadership is all about
Click to expand...

We haven't had a recession like this one in modern history unless you call the Great Depression the modern age. And don't even think of telling me how bad Reagan had it. I lived through that and we didn't have Banks going under, and an auto industry going under, and a housing market collapse, and we didn't have the stock market drop by half, and we didn't have two wars.

He lacks leaderership skills as do his supporters.
Click to expand...

And you guys have leadership skills to offer?? Who? Bush? Cheney? Romney?? the clown show at your debates? Boehener? Donald Trump? Who are you to talk about leadership skills? If you had leadership skills you'd have shown them, not talk about them.

You really need to get over your Bush Derangement Syndrome and accept the fact that Obama is a disaster, lacking the qualifications for the job, and someone who tells you what you want to hear.
Click to expand...

Perhaps it's actually time uou got over your Obama Derangement Syndrome? Every think of that? Tell me something, is it possible you could be wrong? Possible?

Always blaming someone else for his own failures. You have no idea what leadership is all about
Click to expand...

You mean like you're blaming Obama right now for his lack of leadership which you haven't been able to define beyond the horrible jokes you've offered the country. And that's your idea of leadership?? Legitimate Rape. God wanted it, evolution is theory straight from the pits of Hell, Transvaginal ultrasounds whether you need it or not....just where is it that you think you are leading us?
 
Re: SOTU Address:

Catawba said:
The president proposes a budget each year, the Republicans amend it, and the Democrats refuse to vote for the GOP amended version.
Click to expand...

If that is the case, (which I question btw) then how is it that loyal Obama supporters like yourself, can't be honest about who in that case are the true obstructionists? I mean, when you write as you did here about Obama passing his budget, submitting it to congress, then Harry Reid tabling it because republicans added, or detracted things from it, that is the way it is supposed to happen, Obama and Reid are not Kings!? They don't get to say that it is their way or nothing.

Dear Senator Reid,

The law requires Congress to craft a budget every year. It has been 821 days, more than two years, since the United States Senate adopted a budget. The lack of a congressional budget continues to contribute to the fiscal nightmare we now face. Had the Senate adopted a budget in a timely manner this year, as the House of Representatives did, we would not be at an impasse on the debt limit increase at the 11th hour.

Despite not having passed a budget in over two years, your amendment to increase the debt limit deems two consecutive budget resolutions for fiscal years 2012 and 2013. It sets spending allocations for most Senate Committees at the Congressional Budget Office’s rising baseline. Without hearings or debate on these allocations, this provision would provide a further excuse for avoiding a budget and increase the likelihood the Congressional Budget Act will be violated for a third straight year.

This is an abrogation of the responsibilities of the Senate Committee on the Budget and the U.S. Senate. We were not elected to this body and chosen to serve on the Committee on the Budget to see most of the budget levels automatically set based on spending growth projections made by staff. It is this kind of process that has placed the country in a fiscal crisis.

While we have other objections to your proposal, we specifically ask that you remove this provision from your amendment and allow the Committee to fulfill its duties and responsibilities, as set out in law, by allowing the markup of a fiscal year 2012 budget resolution in Committee and, once adopted, its immediate consideration in the Senate.

Very truly yours,

Jeff Sessions, Ranking Member
Chuck Grassley
Mike Enzi
Mike Crapo
John Cornyn
Lindsey Graham
John Thune
Rob Portman
Pat Toomey
Ron Johnson
Kelly Ayotte

Budget Committee Republicans Warn Reid Against Attempting End-Run Around Budget Law In Debt Bill - Press Releases - Media - U.S. Senate Budget Committee
Click to expand...

Now look, Republican's were elected too, they have a say whether you, or Obama, or Reid like it or not. The attempt here for you to portray Congressional GOP as the ones responsible for no budget for, seriously, ever since Obama took office, is just not true in any way possible. This is Reid denying elected Congressional officials from having their constitutional say in these matters, and giving Obama a way to go around the constitution of this country to achieve his unlawful agenda matters that he could never get passed the right way.

It is designed to circumvent the will of the people.
 
Re: SOTU Address:

Adagio said:
We haven't had a recession like this one in modern history unless you call the Great Depression the modern age.
Click to expand...


Stop right there...This is a lie, put forth through platitudinal talking points from the first Obama campaign, and carried forth by disingenuous liberals running cover for their President who has failed miserably to right the ship....

The deepest and longest-lasting recession the United States has experienced since then began in 1980, when Jimmy Carter was president (the gross domestic product dropped 9.6 percent in the second quarter of that year) and did not end until fourth-quarter 1982, almost two years into the Reagan presidency. There were positive quarters during this almost three-year period, resulting in what is known as a double-dip recession, but GDP did not return to the 1979 level until well into 2003. Unemployment peaked at 10.6 percent in the fall of 1982.

Read more: The worst recession? - Washington Times
Follow us: @washtimes on Twitter
Click to expand...
 
Catawba said:
Looks to me like good reasons to replace the firewall between
investment banks and commercial banks.
Click to expand...

Yep, what I thought.

The limitations of the left never cease to amaze me.
The FED through their Quantative easing are buying up MBS..

Where do you think they're buying them from ?

Who's MBS are they ? They're GSE Mortgage backed secutities and with the majority of TARP payed back do you ever think we will be off the hook for the Trillions of toxic mortgages bought up and bundles by the GSEs ?

But that debt your'e ok with .......banks a evil word but Government Service Entities' the people that really ripped us off get a pass from the progressives.

Where do you think Investment Banks got their derivitives from ?
 
Last edited:
Fenton said:
Yep, what I thought.

The limitations of the left never cease to amaze me.
The FED through their Quantative easing are buying up MBS..

Where do you think they're buying them from ?

Who's MBS are they ? They're GSE Mortgage backed secutities and with the majority of TARP payed back do you ever think we will be off the hook for the Trillions of toxic mortgages bought up and bundles by the GSEs ?

But that debt your'e ok with .......banks a evil word but Government Service Entities' the people that really ripped us off get a pass from the progressives.

Where do you think Investment Banks got their derivitives from ?
Click to expand...


Oh careful now....See now you are peeking behind the curtain of Agenda 21, and "sustainable communities".....The entire plan was always with the Global warming scheme, to take away property rights, and redistribute that wealth to others that can't, or won't achieve that level. It is a back door to communism, always has been.
 
Adagio said:
I'm retired pal. Try it. You'll like it . It gives me times to be creative in my view toward people like yourself. Maybe you'll be as creative in your response? :shock:

This is dedicated to you. Enjoy.

Click to expand...


Really? You are retired? You are too old then to be so naive, gullible, and poorly informed. I retired in 2004 at the age of 57. Want to compare experience and bank accounts? I made it and people like don't think I am that smart so if I can make it why do we need the govt and Obama taking a bigger role in each American's life? Still waiting for answers to my questions, how many people are making minimum wage, who are they, and how long do they make that wage/
 
Adagio said:
Burn the village to save it huh? Sounds nice unless you're the one caught in the destruction.
Click to expand...

Businesses have failed before without having to burn the village to the ground. Try to avoid metaphors until you get the hang of the things.
 
Re: SOTU Address:

j-mac said:
Stop right there...This is a lie, put forth through platitudinal talking points from the first Obama campaign, and carried forth by disingenuous liberals running cover for their President who has failed miserably to right the ship....
Click to expand...

It is one of those tragicomic things. A man who has never created a single job in his life has been saying for six years or so that he is going to "create jobs". That's the comic part.

The tragic part is that many people still actually believe him.
 
Grant said:
Businesses have failed before without having to burn the village t
o the ground. Try to avoid metaphors until you get the hang of the things.
Click to expand...

He's retired. Unbelievable.

I honestly thought ad was in his early 20s.

There is no excuse for being his age and being so wrong.
 
Re: SOTU Address:

Adagio;1061481670]We haven't had a recession like this one in modern history unless you call the Great Depression the modern age. And don't even think of telling me how bad Reagan had it. I lived through that and we didn't have Banks going under, and an auto industry going under, and a housing market collapse, and we didn't have the stock market drop by half, and we didn't have two wars.
Click to expand...

no we had people going under due to high inflation and high interest rates. If you lived through it that recession affected you and the individuals more. How did this recession hurt you and your family? Again, more questions that you will ignore.

[/QUOTE]
And you guys have leadership skills to offer?? Who? Bush? Cheney? Romney?? the clown show at your debates? Boehener? Donald Trump? Who are you to talk about leadership skills? If you had leadership skills you'd have shown them, not talk about them
Click to expand...
.

Your option is Obama, Reid, and Pelosi? LOL, ok, will take any of them over that group of clowns. Leaders don't delegate responsibility and blame everyone else for their own failures. A leader delegates authority but not responsibility. The buck never gets to Obama




Perhaps it's actually time uou got over your Obama Derangement Syndrome? Every think of that? Tell me something, is it possible you could be wrong? Possible?
Click to expand...

Results matter, not rhetoric. The Obama results speak for themselves but being retired apparently you missed the economic results of Obama. try BLS.gov, BEA.gov. and the U.S. Treasury sites for actual data


You mean like you're blaming Obama right now for his lack of leadership which you haven't been able to define beyond the horrible jokes you've offered the country. And that's your idea of leadership?? Legitimate Rape. God wanted it, evolution is theory straight from the pits of Hell, Transvaginal ultrasounds whether you need it or not....just where is it that you think you are leading us?
Click to expand...

Obama has been in office 4 years and it is time to man up and accept responsibility for failure. Obama is an economic failure and apparently most supporters are as well.
 
Fenton said:
He's retired. Unbelievable.

I honestly thought ad was in his early 20s.

There is no excuse for being his age and being so wrong.
Click to expand...

Yes, I also assumed the same and still remain skeptical of his claim. Early 20's sounds about right.
 
Adagio said:
I'm retired pal. Try it. You'll like it . It gives me times to be creative in my view toward people like yourself. Maybe you'll be as creative in your response? :shock:

This is dedicated to you. Enjoy.

Click to expand...



All that time om your hands and you use it being told how to think. All that time on your hands on you use it being td what to think.

Creative ? Not so much.

Higly succeptible to empty plattitudes and irrational blame ? Yup..
 
Re: SOTU Address:

j-mac said:
If that is the case, (which I question btw) then how is it that loyal Obama supporters like yourself, can't be honest about who in that case are the true obstructionists? I mean, when you write as you did here about Obama passing his budget, submitting it to congress, then Harry Reid tabling it because republicans added, or detracted things from it, that is the way it is supposed to happen, Obama and Reid are not Kings!? They don't get to say that it is their way or nothing.
Click to expand...

The difference being that the GOP is being obstructionists on what is best for the country, in order to benefit the wealthy. After witnessing the failure of 30 years of trickle down economics and deregulation, I've got to tell you. That **** don't fly anymore!



Now look, Republican's were elected too, they have a say whether you, or Obama, or Reid like it or not. The attempt here for you to portray Congressional GOP as the ones responsible for no budget for, seriously, ever since Obama took office, is just not true in any way possible. This is Reid denying elected Congressional officials from having their constitutional say in these matters, and giving Obama a way to go around the constitution of this country to achieve his unlawful agenda matters that he could never get passed the right way.

It is designed to circumvent the will of the people.
Click to expand...

We reelected the president to do what he is doing, standing up against the continuation of trickle down economics and deregulation.
 
Fenton said:
Where do you think Investment Banks got their derivitives from ?
Click to expand...

Much of what was being gambled on were commercial bank holdings, or the lack thereof.

"Former Citigroup Chairman Richard Parsons made the understatement of the year in an interview with Bloomberg when he blamed the 1999 repeal of the Depression era Glass-Steagall Act for helping to set off the global financial crisis.

With one commercial bank after another collapsing during the early 1930s, there was a widespread belief that their broker-dealer activities interfered with their primary responsibilities as depositary institutions, and ultimately helped accelerate the worst financial crisis the nation has ever seen.

Lawmakers responded to that rash of commercial bank failures with Glass-Steagall, which forced banks to decide whether they wanted to continue as either commercial or investment banks, but not both. The law, which famously helped birth Morgan Stanley from J.P. Morgan , survived for six decades and kept banks during that time from making the sort of risky bets that drove the global economy into a ditch in 2008.

"To some extent what we saw in the 2007, 2008 crash was the result of the throwing off of Glass-Steagall," Parsons told Bloomberg. "Have we gotten our arms around it yet? I don't think so because the financial services sector moves so fast."

That's putting things mildly, to say the least. Nearly four years have gone by since the fateful month of September 2008, and with every passing day it becomes clearer that had that law been allowed to stand, AIG wouldn't have been allowed to make bets on credit default swaps, sell insurance on asset-backed security pools like collateralized debt obligations or batches of subprime mortgages, and eventually become the epicenter for the worst crisis in nearly 70 years. And a megabank like Citigroup might not have ever seen the light of day."

What Led to the Crisis? The Repeal of Glass-Steagall, Stupid - Advanced Trading
 
Catawba said:
Much of what was being gambled on were commercial bank
holdings, or the lack thereof.

"Former Citigroup Chairman Richard Parsons made the understatement of the year in an interview with Bloomberg when he blamed the 1999 repeal of the Depression era Glass-Steagall Act for helping to set off the global financial crisis.

With one commercial bank after another collapsing during the early 1930s, there was a widespread belief that their broker-dealer activities interfered with their primary responsibilities as depositary institutions, and ultimately helped accelerate the worst financial crisis the nation has ever seen.

Lawmakers responded to that rash of commercial bank failures with Glass-Steagall, which forced banks to decide whether they wanted to continue as either commercial or investment banks, but not both. The law, which famously helped birth Morgan Stanley from J.P. Morgan , survived for six decades and kept banks during that time from making the sort of risky bets that drove the global economy into a ditch in 2008.

"To some extent what we saw in the 2007, 2008 crash was the result of the throwing off of Glass-Steagall," Parsons told Bloomberg. "Have we gotten our arms around it yet? I don't think so because the financial services sector moves so fast."

That's putting things mildly, to say the least. Nearly four years have gone by since the fateful month of September 2008, and with every passing day it becomes clearer that had that law been allowed to stand, AIG wouldn't have been allowed to make bets on credit default swaps, sell insurance on asset-backed security pools like collateralized debt obligations or batches of subprime mortgages, and eventually become the epicenter for the worst crisis in nearly 70 years. And a megabank like Citigroup might not have ever seen the light of day."

What Led to the Crisis? The Repeal of Glass-Steagall, Stupid - Advanced Trading
Click to expand...

Make bets on credit default swaps ? They were collateral for MBSs from the GSEs. They were (CDS) BY LAW collateral for MBSs from the GSEs.

Your'e willing to ignore about 80% of the cause of the sub-prime machinations to put it all on the repeal of Glass Steagal and credit default swaps ?

Its ridiculous. Glass Steagal wouldn't have been an issue if the GSEs hadnt been mandated by HUD to buy up massive amounts of bad loans from lenders who were forced to lower their lending standards.I
 
Fenton said:
Make bets on credit default swaps ? They were collateral for MBSs from the GSEs. They were (CDS) BY LAW collateral for MBSs from the GSEs.

Your'e willing to ignore about 80% of the cause of the sub-prime machinations to put it all on the repeal of Glass Steagal and credit default swaps ?

Its ridiculous. Glass Steagal wouldn't have been an issue if the GSEs hadnt been mandated by HUD to buy up massive amounts of bad loans from lenders who were forced to lower their lending standards.I
Click to expand...


I've studied the issue and disagree. Do you support allowing banks to continue to be too large to fail?
 
Re: SOTU Address:

Catawba said:
The difference being that the GOP is being obstructionists on what is best for the country, in order to benefit the wealthy. After witnessing the failure of 30 years of trickle down economics and deregulation, I've got to tell you. That **** don't fly anymore!
Click to expand...

Trickle down is a pejorative term meant to incite those whom understand little in these matters. What matters is that if you look at the two similar recessions, the one under Carter in the mid to late 70s, and the one Bush left Obama with this time around, the difference is that under Reagan he had turned around that recession in about two years, and so far Obama is failing to do such, touting that this is the new norm....You satisfied with that?

We reelected the president to do what he is doing, standing up against the continuation of trickle down economics and deregulation.
Click to expand...

So you wanted a dictator, we get that. Only problem is, in this country, "That **** don't fly".....
 
Re: SOTU Address:

j-mac said:
Trickle down is a pejorative term meant to incite those whom understand little in these matters. What matters is that if you look at the two similar recessions, the one under Carter in the mid to late 70s, and the one Bush left Obama with this time around, the difference is that under Reagan he had turned around that recession in about two years, and so far Obama is failing to do such, touting that this is the new norm....You satisfied with that?
Click to expand...

Only those that have no concept of the severity of this recession compared to the one under Carter and Reagan would buy your version of history.


So you wanted a dictator, we get that. Only problem is, in this country, "That **** don't fly".....
Click to expand...

You have the ability to mimic me, aren't you special! :cool:
 
Re: SOTU Address:

Catawba said:
Only those that have no concept of the severity of this recession compared to the one under Carter and Reagan would buy your version of history.
Click to expand...

Ok, put the stats of both recessions side by side and let's take a look.....If you have the intellectual honesty to do such, you'd see that they are remarkably similar, that is up to the point where the two differing approaches, Reagan on the one side, and Obama on the other took over, then the picture is striking in the failure of one, and it ain't Reagan....

You have the ability to mimic me, aren't you special!
Click to expand...

Well, don't try and get cute, and I won't have to point out your foolishness.
 
Catawba said:
I've studied the issue and disagree. Do you support allowing banks to continue to be too large to fail?
Click to expand...

It sounds like youv'e "studdied" what fits your narrative...ie " banks are bad ".

You CANT disagree with me because I've posted facts. MBSs that originated from the GSEs HAD to be colateralized via banking regulations and that was done with insurance......or CDSs.

To big too fail is a term the media and HollyWood came up with to convince people that somehow private lending institutions were the blame for massive amounts of " Govt Backed Securities ".

You " studdied " it but have completely missed the 5 trillion of low quality loans bought by the GSEs.

Yea I dont think so...
 
Re: SOTU Address:

j-mac said:
Ok, put the stats of both recessions side by side and let's take a look.....If you have the intellectual honesty to do such, you'd see that they are remarkably similar, that is up to the point where the two differing approaches, Reagan on the one side, and Obama on the other took over, then the picture is striking in the failure of one, and it ain't Reagan....



Well, don't try and get cute, and I won't have to point out your foolishness.
Click to expand...



U.S. Recession Worst Since Great Depression, Revised Data Show
 
Fenton said:
It sounds like youv'e "studdied" what fits your narrative...ie " banks are bad ".

You CANT disagree with me because I've posted facts. MBSs that originated from the GSEs HAD to be colateralized via banking regulations and that was done with insurance......or CDSs.

To big too fail is a term the media and HollyWood came up with to convince people that somehow private lending institutions were the blame for massive amounts of " Govt Backed Securities ".

You " studdied " it but have completely missed the 5 trillion of low quality loans bought by the GSEs.

Yea I dont think so...
Click to expand...


Banks too big too fail are why our wise forefathers enacted the Glass-Steagall Act after the Great Depression. Those that refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
 
Catawba said:

U.S. Recession Worst Since Great Depression, Revised Data Show
Click to expand...

Are you seriously trying to mitigate 4 years of failure by arguing the effects of the sub prime collapse were worse than first thought ?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom