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Thread: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    That was ~3 days after the invasion and Russia was being charged with having done such things. Presumably, any deliveries that may have taken place occured before the deadline and the beginning of the war. Russia denied it.

    What I'm wondering is, if you believe this claim by the US, do you believe unsupported, no-evidence and denied claims by the US in general, or only when it serves your purpose.

    every action has a reaction, no matter who does it. when osama bin laden attacked US, US attacked afghanistan and taliban was thrown out of power and osama bin laden was killed eventually. one can say that's a blow back too.
    Ohhh, please. Not the "everything happened because of something else and therefor everything is connected and nothing and no one can ever be blamed for anything". Goood lord, I don't think I can take that sophomoric stoned crap. If this is what qualifies as philosophy, then we are doomed.

    One cannot, cannot, blame their actions on someone else. Everything one does must be legit. If not, one must, absolutely must, blame themself.

    as I mentioned earlier, speaking of international politics like somehow morals have anything to do with them is too naive. it's never about morals. there is no good and bad.
    That's sick... Pretending there is no right and wrong, no good and evil. It turns my stomach to think that someone would consider a genocidal dictator terrorist state lacking even basic human rights to be the moral equivalent of a liberal western democracy.

    Why? Why would a position be so disconnected from reality.

    citation?
    also, they would get everybody on their ass if they had admitted that.
    Ok, you now obviously have no idea what you are talking about. You go find citations, you need them not me. Everyone else here knows Iran openly supplies Hamas.

    Let me know when you get on their ass.
    Last edited by ecofarm; 02-01-13 at 01:42 PM.

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    That was ~3 days after the invasion and Russia was being charged with having done such things. Presumably, any deliveries that may have taken place occured before the deadline and the beginning of the war. Russia denied it.

    What I'm wondering is, if you believe this claim by the US, do you believe unsupported, no-evidence and denied claims by the US in general, or only when it serves your purpose.
    I'd rather take US's word over Russia's. although, you're right, there's no evidence so it remains a claim.

    Ohhh, please. Not the "everything happened because of something else and therefor everything is connected and nothing and no one can ever be blamed for anything". Goood lord, I don't think I can take that sophomoric stoned crap. If this is what qualifies as philosophy, then we are doomed.

    One cannot, cannot, blame their actions on someone else. Everything one does must be legit. If not, one must, absolutely must, blame themself.
    you can place blame anywhere you want to. all I'm saying is that it doesn't play a role in political decisions which take place. one as a person can judge actions and decisions based on moral or religous grounds, but it doesn't really have a analytic value since that's not a factor contributing to a decision made by the players of the scene.

    That's sick... Pretending there is no right and wrong, no good and evil. Oh, it turns my stomach to think that someone would consider a genocidal dictator terrorist state lacking even basic human rights to be the moral equivalent of a liberal western democracy.

    Why? Why would a position be so disconnected from reality.
    there is a good and evil, and definitely a brutal dictator should get what he deserves. but this kind of thinking does not help predicting the events of future.

    Ok, you now obviously have no idea what you are talking about. You go find citations, you need them not me. Everyone else here knows Iran openly supplies Hamas.
    there's plenty of evidence that revolutionary guards support hamas and hezbollah, but you can't find a single quote by Iranian president who says that. they always use ambiguous terms and general statements in their supporting arguments and never admit it outright.

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    puff puff pass

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    Why do I keep seeing air strike and attack in quotations? As though that's not what it actually was. I've seen it on at least 4 news sites.

    It's not like, "I did not have "sexual relations" with that woman," or "legitimate rape." It was a goddamn air strike. Whether it was justified or not, that doesn't change the fact that it was an attack. I feel like we're constantly trying to justify Israel's actions and sugarcoat them. Bombs were dropped. Things blew up. People died. A preemptive attack is still an attack.

    That said, I maintain my belief that we should turn Israel loose and let them reap the consequences if they decide to attack the wrong nation or group. If we won't tolerate aggression from North Korea or Serbia, why should we tolerate it from Israel? Now, if Israel doesn't engage in any sort of provocative actions, and they come under fire from one of their neighbors, then I wholeheartedly support honoring our alliance and putting our boot on that nation's throat. Ideally, we would have a noninterventionist foreign policy, but if we forge a defensive alliance, honor dictates that we must uphold it.

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    now this is a weird position to take:

    Turkish FM slams Israel for alleged Syria strikes
    Turkish FM slams Israel for alleg... JPost - Diplomacy & Politics
    Davutoglu accuses Assad of inaction after IAF strike, suggests failure to respond is due to "secret agreement" with Israel.

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor View Post
    Why do I keep seeing air strike and attack in quotations? As though that's not what it actually was. I've seen it on at least 4 news sites.

    It's not like, "I did not have "sexual relations" with that woman," or "legitimate rape." It was a goddamn air strike. Whether it was justified or not, that doesn't change the fact that it was an attack. I feel like we're constantly trying to justify Israel's actions and sugarcoat them. Bombs were dropped. Things blew up. People died. A preemptive attack is still an attack.

    That said, I maintain my belief that we should turn Israel loose and let them reap the consequences if they decide to attack the wrong nation or group. If we won't tolerate aggression from North Korea or Serbia, why should we tolerate it from Israel? Now, if Israel doesn't engage in any sort of provocative actions, and they come under fire from one of their neighbors, then I wholeheartedly support honoring our alliance and putting our boot on that nation's throat. Ideally, we would have a noninterventionist foreign policy, but if we forge a defensive alliance, honor dictates that we must uphold it.
    It has been clear for decades now that Israel is always held to much higher standards than their neighbors who, as we all know, have no real standards at all. At least none from a recent century.

    There are real problems going on in the Middle East, and North Africa, while the US president muses about women in the military, or Gay weddings. Obama has led the US military to defeat in two important areas of the world. He intends to weaken this military further with huge spending cuts, and now no one fears them. Other militarizes are growing. He ignores the debt, ignores the international problems and is instead looking at social issues. He is not a man of the world, he is a man of a medium sized community.

    This is the guy who gave the Muslim Brotherhood 22 fighter jets and over 200 tanks, while insulting and undermining the leader of Israel. He is abandoning former allies while cozying up to the Russians and Islamist nutjobs.

    Barrack Obama has been a horrible mistake, and it will get worse.

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by youknowwho View Post
    They know who 'the strong horse' is. Naturally they'll have to side with the Islamists.

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    They know who 'the strong horse' is. Naturally they'll have to side with the Islamists.
    they are technically at war with Syria.

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    Israel does as it pleases - Israel News | Haaretz Daily Newspaper

    interesting opinion article.

    The prevalent basic assumption in Israel is that it is allowed to do anything. It is rooted deep in its consciousness, and any criticism or even doubt is seen as heresy and treason.

    Israel may fly in Lebanon’s sovereign airspace ‏(or any other Arab state’s‏) as often as it desires − that’s taken for granted. It may, of course, bombard anytime that someone foresees danger. It may invade any place, settle anywhere. It may do ‏(almost‏) anything.

    The “anything allowed” concept was shaped in the Israeli consciousness on the basis of several assumptions − some solid and justified; some irrelevant; some groundless. These include the Holocaust memory; our exclusive right to the land, being the chosen people; the danger to our survival; the whole world being against us; the Arabs all wanting to wipe us out.

    ...


    The only question raised in Israeli discourse is whether it’s working now. Until now it’s worked. Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Iran, Sudan and, of course, the Palestinians wiped the saliva, said it was rain and restrained themselves, because they are weak and Israel is strong.

    A society agitating over drafting ultra-Orthodox men isn’t even willing to try to doubt whether these bombardments, these daring hush-hush operations beyond the lines, are doing us any good. They’ve worked so far, but were they all necessary? Won’t Israel pay for them one day? Even according to foreign sources, Israel isn’t dealing with that. It’s enough that a handful of politicians and generals have decided what’s good for it, and to hell with all the troublesome questions.

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    Re: Russia concern at Israeli 'air strike' on Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by youknowwho View Post
    It's not all that interesting.

    Do you buy into this opinion piece?

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