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Thread: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years[W: 395]

  1. #91
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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    Oh I'm sorry, you called it "money hoarding"

    My bad



    Tucker hasn't explained anything actually
    perhaps you should read his posts again...

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    I just started a thread on the same subject ... can someone tell me how to delete my thread?

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    What you see is irrelevant to the issue. Money hoarding has a negative impact on the economy.
    No, money hoarding is a real behavior, it's like the hoarders you see on the reality shows, it's a mental switch that gets flipped and their life spins out of control as they continue to focus almost exclusively on adding to their savings.

    This is not what occurs when you're referring to the overall economy or "most businesses and the top 1%". What they are doing, is emotionally, rationally, *no different than most anyone else is doing in similar economic cirucmstances*. They are not some special strain of the human genome that wants to suck the earth dry, it's people you know and love and who for better or worse, happen to earn a lot more than most (typically through professions like doctor, laywer, investment, business owners, etc.). If you're still in denial, reverse it to those in opposite circumstances. Why don't the unemployed bulid infrastructure free of charge while they are in between jobs so that they can continue adding to our economy during the downtime? Besides, it would keep their minds occupied off the stress of finding a new job, and they might meet some people, network, it would look good on a resume, etc., etc.

    My armchair recollection of this in terms of economics, I thought GOVERNMENT was supposed to save during the good times or at least artificially tighten, that way if the economy slows down, they can rachet up spending and loosen up the belt that they had tightened during the boom (think interest rates and more). Why didn't they do that? So the top earners have to live the way you want them to, because Bush when crazy with the checkbook (For example)?

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight View Post
    An oil & gas economy, which is inherently counter-cyclical.
    LOL. !!!

    So its a bad thing that our local economy is growing ¿

    That we are supplying jobs for people that ran for their lives from the liberal blue plague states.

    But wait....its "counter cyclical" ....

    Hillarious.....I'm still "all a chuckle" over your pathetic attempt to undermine our local burgeoning economy.

    We're far better off and will continue to be when this number is revised down even more.
    The New Democratic Party Slogan :

    " Return to Power By Any Means Necessary "

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative
    I strongly believe you make your own opportunities....
    That's just not true, though. Wealthy people are granted many opportunities that others have to struggle to even have a chance to receive. A kid who comes from a family with an income of $1,000,000 per year will not have to work as hard as a kid from a family that earns $40,000 annually. That's just reality in a world where things need to be paid for.
    This is why I put Conservative on Ignore. It is not a matter of “stupid”, it is that he fervently “strongly believe(s)” things in the face of contradictory evidence. That in the US today roughly 1/2 of the determination of your economic status is via whose loins you happened to pop out of, rather than the meritocracy that it is imagined as. This was not always the case but that is where we have found ourselves, and the worse for it ultimately.

    As we rate to some other 1st world democracies.

    In short, he is fully insistent on NOT acquiring information, not learning, but rather blathering the same discredited crap over and over and over and over and over and over and…
    Last edited by Dwight; 01-30-13 at 01:26 PM.

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Juiposa View Post
    Cutting spending OR raising taxes will cause recession, especially with the $1 trillion you guys need to balance. A minor recession is enevitable when balancing a deficit so large.
    Define "minor".


    Anyone worth their salt saw this coming. Austerity=recession. Maybe somebody in politics might listen this time...nah, probably. not.
    "Advocates of capitalism are apt to appeal to the sacred principles of liberty, which are embodied in one maxim: the fortunate must not be restrained in the exercise of tyranny over the unfortunate." - Bertrand Russell

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    LOL. !!!

    So its a bad thing that our local economy is growing ¿
    Exactly how do you get that?
    That we are supplying jobs for people that ran for their lives from the liberal blue plague states.
    The “plague” states that on the whole provide the meat of the government funding?
    But wait….its "counter cyclical" ....
    Yes. Look it up. Maybe you won’t embarrass yourself so much next time…

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    So if they cut spending, you'd support tax increases?



    That's just not true, though. Wealthy people are granted many opportunities that others have to struggle to even have a chance to receive. A kid who comes from a family with an income of $1,000,000 per year will not have to work as hard as a kid from a family that earns $40,000 annually. That's just reality in a world where things need to be paid for.





    I guess if you abuse the English language with blatant disregard like that it's "whining".



    What if it's invested in a Chinese company? Does that help the US economy? What if it is put a Swiss Bank account (the financial equivilant of burying it in your backyard)?






    What are you talking about? I ran a construction business for years. Did you make something up in your head and convince yourself it was true?
    Describe your "perfect" world in which nothing has to be paid for. Who would "choose" to work if nothing has to be paid for? We would likely all seek to increase our knowledge, travel around the nation and enjoy the freedom of not having to bore ourselves with actually working.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    I called something that wasn't "saving" money hoarding. When you make **** up and try to argue against teh imaginary thing that you made up, you only make the world around you a dumber place to be.
    You're the one making **** up with catchphrases like "Money Hoarding"

    Correction: you haven't understood that which was explained. Probably because you have an imaginary idea of what I am saying which bears no resemblance whatsoever to that which I have been saying.
    /yawn

    It's the same thing with you people every time. When people don't buy into your nonsense you try and belittle them and call them stupid. Let's look at some of your pearls of wisdom in this thread shall we?

    A 40% reduction in defense spending will have some short-term economic consequences. Any cuts in spending would have this kind of consequence as less money being put into the economy will obviously affect the economy.
    Except there was no reduction in Government Spending last quarter

    http://www.fms.treas.gov/mts/mts.pdf

    To explain: $10,000,000 given to one person probably will not get spent within a year or even 10, but $10,000,000 given to 10,000,000 people will probably get spent dozens of times over in a year. In the first scenario, the 10 mil is effectively out of the economy. It's not being used to purchase goods or services. In the latter scenario, that money is continually being used to purchase goods and services though. It's transferring hands over and over again. It benefits many more people.
    The problem with this scenario is that the 10K isn't "given" to one person, unless we're talking about Government Spending/Welfare/Stimulus. As we saw with Obama's Failed Stimulus, there was no fiscal multiplier, hence a more proper way to characterize the money "given" would be to call it waste. Wealth that will never be recovered.

    Your analogy has absolutely NOTHING to do with business assets, production, capital goods, Hiring, ect.

    They might as well for all the value it brings to the US economy if they hoard it. A common location for some of that money are foreign investments and foreign banks.
    Do you have any idea how much debt most companies have incurred over the last 4 years? Even if this were true, why do you think they are putting money in foreign banks? Are you advocating offshore banking be made illegal?

    You're proving my point here. Wages and benefits paid to the workers do this. I.E. money distributed to many people who will then SPEND that money.

    Thus, wage freezes hurt the economy, especially when they are done in conjunction with increased profits which are hoarded among the few who already have plenty and thus, do NOT spend that money.
    Do businesses hire people to pay wages or make money? Are you advocating businesses be forced to hire people and pay people more, regardless of economic conditions?

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    Re: Economy shrinks for first time in 3 1/2 years

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight View Post
    That in the US today roughly 1/2 of the determination of your economic status is via whose loins you happened to pop out of, rather than the meritocracy that is imagined as.
    And what about the other half?
    There are lots of examples of folks that became a success from nothing ... yes, even these days. Many times despite rumble strips.
    And are you assuming the half you're talking about haven't the skillsets of the loins they popped out of? And they aren't employing them?
    Sounds pretty defeatist.

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