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Thread: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Maybe ethiopians were a threat to jewish supremacist ideology and hence, the needed to be stopped from breeding.

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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    If it is true, then it is sterilization as per the Webster's definition of that word. My question was worded quite specifically to test whether the definition applies verbatim.
    "There sterilization procedures for both men and women. These are permanent and for the most part irreversible (or intended to be).

    snip

    What is female sterilization?

    Permanent female sterilization can be achieved through two procedures:

    Tubal ligation: This is a surgical procedure performed in a hospital, usually with no over night stay. It involves cutting the fallopian tubes and then tying and cauterizing the cut ends, so the egg does not get out of the tube into the uterus to be fertilized.
    Hysteroscopic sterilization (Essure procedure): A hysteroscope, a lighted telescopic instrument, is inserted into the uterus through the cervix. The hysteroscope is used to insert spring-like coils called micro-inserts in the opening of the fallopian tubes. During the following months, scar tissue will form around the inserts and essentially plug the tubes which will keep sperm from fertilizing an egg. A follow-up visit to the doctor is required to make sure that the tubes are completely blocked.

    Back-up contraception must be used until blockage is confirmed. This is a minor surgical procedure and requires anesthesia."

    Birth Control: Sterilization | Information for Teens
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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    "There sterilization procedures for both men and women. These are permanent and for the most part irreversible (or intended to be).

    snip

    What is female sterilization?

    Permanent female sterilization can be achieved through two procedures:

    Tubal ligation: This is a surgical procedure performed in a hospital, usually with no over night stay. It involves cutting the fallopian tubes and then tying and cauterizing the cut ends, so the egg does not get out of the tube into the uterus to be fertilized.
    Hysteroscopic sterilization (Essure procedure): A hysteroscope, a lighted telescopic instrument, is inserted into the uterus through the cervix. The hysteroscope is used to insert spring-like coils called micro-inserts in the opening of the fallopian tubes. During the following months, scar tissue will form around the inserts and essentially plug the tubes which will keep sperm from fertilizing an egg. A follow-up visit to the doctor is required to make sure that the tubes are completely blocked.

    Back-up contraception must be used until blockage is confirmed. This is a minor surgical procedure and requires anesthesia."

    Birth Control: Sterilization | Information for Teens
    why does everyone seem to have the silly idea that they can "trump" a dictionary definition of the word by linking something from a website? How does that website counteract the undeniable fact that the word is being used in a way that fits with the definition verbatim?
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    why does everyone seem to have the silly idea that they can "trump" a dictionary definition of the word by linking something from a website? How does that website counteract the undeniable fact that the word is being used in a way that fits with the definition verbatim?

    Sorry Tucker, but using the dictionary as your 'go to' in the attempt to inflame the issue can only be described as a disingenuous tactic, I know you are better than that....I hope.
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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Sorry Tucker, but using the dictionary as your 'go to' in the attempt to inflame the issue can only be described as a disingenuous tactic, I know you are better than that....I hope.
    You know what, it is really rather pathetic that using a word correctly is considered "inflaming" the issue and that the people who take this phenomenally pathetic stance will actively ingore any actual positions of a person, ignore the facts about a word, and ignore all reason and common sense in order to present the LIE that a person who uses a word correctly is doing something disingenuous.

    That is pathetic, but **** honesty, right? it's easier to pretend someone else is doing something wrong that it is to actually accept a cold hard truth that we don't quite like.

    Go ahead, tell me how it's disingenuous to use a dictionary to define words. I'm sure that the fact that such a concept is truly ****ing retarded will not affect your decision to pretend it is true.
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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Of course not. You are not rendered incapable of reproducing by a condom, your sperm is simply blocked from meeting the egg. Your biological mechanisms are unchanged.

    Read post #549 if you are still having difficulties with determining the operational mechanisms of different birth control methods.
    You didn't make reference to a condom as a "sterilization technique"?

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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    You didn't make reference to a condom as a "sterilization technique"?
    Of course not. I thought I was really quite clear about which birth control techniques would be correctly classified as "sterilization techniques": The BC techniques which render a person incapable of reproducing or deprive one of the power to reproduce.

    I also specifically placed condoms into an entirely different group of BC techniques in the very next breath of that post (they were specifically mentioned along with the diaphragm as examples of BC methods which work by virtue of physically preventing the gametes from interacting).
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    You know what, it is really rather pathetic that using a word correctly is considered "inflaming" the issue and that the people who take this phenomenally pathetic stance will actively ingore any actual positions of a person, ignore the facts about a word, and ignore all reason and common sense in order to present the LIE that a person who uses a word correctly is doing something disingenuous.

    That is pathetic, but **** honesty, right? it's easier to pretend someone else is doing something wrong that it is to actually accept a cold hard truth that we don't quite like.

    Go ahead, tell me how it's disingenuous to use a dictionary to define words. I'm sure that the fact that such a concept is truly ****ing retarded will not affect your decision to pretend it is true.

    Tucker, you can feign outrage all you like, but the fact remains that standard forms of BC are NOT sterilization. The two are totally different, not only in scope, but in practice.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Tucker, you can feign outrage all you like, but the fact remains that standard forms of BC are NOT sterilization. The two are totally different, not only in scope, but in practice.
    Stop making **** up and pretending it is true. It is disingenuous.

    The FACTS are as follows:


    1 Even if you decide to use the definition of "sterilization" that had the permanance requirement to the exclusion of all of all of the other valid definitons of the word, sterilization IS a standard form of birth control. It's an extremely common approach. That alone proves that you are just making **** up because of your own irrational fear of the word applying here.

    2 The use of the word in the context of any procedure or medication which deprives a person of the power of reproduction is perfectly valid, regardless of the timeframe of that deprivation.


    The real issue here is not, nor has it ever been, my choice to use a word correctly or other people's irrational distaste for a word being used correctly. It is about the consent of those who were given the injections. If they gave informed consent, then the acts of sterilization were fine. Hell, even commendable. If there was no consent, then the acts were not ok. The permanance or impermanance of the particular procedure is not, in any way shape or form, a mitigating factor here. It's entirely about whether consent was granted.

    Entirely. If consent wasn't granted, the impermanance of the procedure doesn't make it "less horrific". If consent was granted, it would not matter if the procedure was permanant, it would still be perfectly fine, even commendable.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

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    Re: Israel gave birth control to Ethiopian Jews without their consent [W:283,569]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Stop making **** up and pretending it is true. It is disingenuous.

    The FACTS are as follows:


    1 Even if you decide to use the definition of "sterilization" that had the permanance requirement to the exclusion of all of all of the other valid definitons of the word, sterilization IS a standard form of birth control. It's an extremely common approach. That alone proves that you are just making **** up because of your own irrational fear of the word applying here.

    2 The use of the word in the context of any procedure or medication which deprives a person of the power of reproduction is perfectly valid, regardless of the timeframe of that deprivation.
    You seem more than a little defensive here...Look, we disagree. Contraceptives, and their use is not sterilization no way, no how. I don't care how loose you want to define the term. Common usage of the term means something, and my impression is that you are using the term in lieu of the term contraceptive to make the bad situation Israel has been doing up until now seem worse than it is. That is just inflammatory imho.

    The real issue here is not, nor has it ever been, my choice to use a word correctly or other people's irrational distaste for a word being used correctly.
    If you were using the word correctly then there wouldn't be any issue with you use of it....

    It is about the consent of those who were given the injections. If they gave informed consent, then the acts of sterilization were fine. Hell, even commendable. If there was no consent, then the acts were not ok. The permanance or impermanance of the particular procedure is not, in any way shape or form, a mitigating factor here. It's entirely about whether consent was granted.
    Agreed. For what its worth I don't think that Isreal's policy was a correct one in this matter.

    Entirely. If consent wasn't granted, the impermanance of the procedure doesn't make it "less horrific". If consent was granted, it would not matter if the procedure was permanant, it would still be perfectly fine, even commendable.
    Redundant.
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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