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Thread: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Putting aside for the moment the fact that I am opposed to women in most military duties to begin with.....

    The ONLY way that I could see this being acceptable would be if these women were held to exactly the same standards that men are for the same MOS's. If there is an existing height/weight requirement, they should have to meet it. Certain PT criteria.... they should have to meet them. Training and capability requirement should be exactly the same. NO EXCEPTIONS. ONLY, if these women can meet those same criteria should they be allowed to be in these roles. Either that, or reduced the criteria for the men as well.

    Additionally, if this goes into place, all American women should be required to register with selective services.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    The "women are in combat already" fallacy has to stop. Women are not outside the wire actively seeking out the enemy. EVER. What they are doing is convoys and occassional local patrols with infantry squads for the purpose of exploiting women for intelligence. These patrols are typically accompanied by higher ranking members of the unit, intel guys, terps, etc and are not there for the purpose of engaging the enemy. By occassional I mean maybe once a week, if that. As far as convoys, they don't see combat as most think of it. What they see is their 50 vehicle logistics convoy take some pot shots, an IED, maybe an RPG. They sit inside the truck (just like everyone else in the convoy), hope none of it hits them (just like everyone else in the convoy), then continue on once the attack stops. Sure, there is the occassional instance where a woman engages the enemy, but it is rare. For all of the combat these women are supposedely in, where are the valorous awards? There has been one female since the WOT began that received one (silver star). And guess what? She was a medic on a convoy. Look, I'm not downplaying what this woman did or any other woman. They have served honorably. But they are not out actively seeking the enemy and going out on patrol everyday like a grunt is. They are not playing grunt and simply not receiving the credit for it. That is false and something that many, not saying you specifically Boo, are touting as the reason for this lift.
    I think you're making a distinction without a meaning. We know they were and are not actively out running those types of missions. The argument is the battlefield is no longer structured that way. The old paradigm no longer holds meaning. And in this new paradigm women are in fact already on the front lines. They are correct.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    Putting aside for the moment the fact that I am opposed to women in most military duties to begin with.....

    The ONLY way that I could see this being acceptable would be if these women were held to exactly the same standards that men are for the same MOS's. If there is an existing height/weight requirement, they should have to meet it. Certain PT criteria.... they should have to meet them. Training and capability requirement should be exactly the same. NO EXCEPTIONS. ONLY, if these women can meet those same criteria should they be allowed to be in these roles. Either that, or reduced the criteria for the men as well.

    Additionally, if this goes into place, all American women should be required to register with selective services.
    Your selective service comment: that's ignorant . . . the majority of teenage females would be unfit for duty one way or the other and inhibited by childcare, pregnancy and other such things. I don't support it for males, either - so obviously I'm just not going to ok selective service no matter what. It should be dissolved entirely.

    Of course - I support mandatory birth control and other such things, too - to avoid pregnancy while on the front and in service....so on, so forth. I'm stringent and people accuse me of being on the psycho side. I see the pregnant female soldier to be the weakest link in the chain and entirely useless.
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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    It might work if combat arms units are segregated by gender, but co-ed units will be a failure.
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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Your selective service comment: that's ignorant . . . the majority of teenage females would be unfit for duty one way or the other and inhibited by childcare, pregnancy and other such things. I don't support it for males, either - so obviously I'm just not going to ok selective service no matter what. It should be dissolved entirely.
    You think that most American males would be fit for service if the draft were to be re-instituted today? I definitely don't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Of course - I support mandatory birth control and other such things, too - to avoid pregnancy while on the front and in service....so on, so forth. I'm stringent and people accuse me of being on the psycho side. I see the pregnant female soldier to be the weakest link in the chain and entirely useless.
    Very true. I'm not a fan of women in the military to begin with, but I definitely feel that they should not be involved in combat operations/

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Pilot View Post
    Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles | World news | guardian.co.uk


    Personally, I'm fine with this as long as they physical requirements are the same. If you can't lift enough or run long enough, you're putting other people in extra danger as well as yourself.
    I might be ok with it if they keep the physical and mental requirements 100% the same. My biggest concern is the hygiene requirements. From what I understand the Army requires that all females be able to shower at least once every 3 days. I went weeks and weeks without anything even resembling a shower, sitting on OPs on the top of mountains. For 6 months at our COP we had nothing but water bottle showers.

    I just don't see how females could go through that hygenically. I know even us males suffered pretty bad from it.

    Quote Originally Posted by MarineTpartier View Post
    The sort of fighting that occurs in a COIN environment is much different than a conventional war. Women routinely see combat as they pass by an ambush in a vehicle. My 7 year old could do that. I'm talking about locating, closing with, and destroying the enemy by fire and maneuver Private Ryan style. Someday, we will be in a conventional war again. And when we get to that point, the females will not be able to keep up. That's not sexist, it's just a fact.
    What they don't realize is that in a lot of places in afghanistan, it STILL is like that. Foot patrols through the mountains every day and contact several times a week.
    Last edited by RabidAlpaca; 01-24-13 at 11:39 AM.
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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Warfare, like everything else, is becoming more mechanized. This will be a moot issue very soon, since robots will be doing almost all of the fighting.
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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Warfare, like everything else, is becoming more mechanized. This will be a moot issue very soon, since robots will be doing almost all of the fighting.
    Not that I believe warfare will ever become totally mechanized, but until then this is a very bad idea.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Warfare, like everything else, is becoming more mechanized. This will be a moot issue very soon, since robots will be doing almost all of the fighting.
    I call dibs on at least one BattleMech.
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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    Not that I believe warfare will ever become totally mechanized, but until then this is a very bad idea.
    Since most men don't win arguments with their women anyway it might work well.
    Think about it have a hot looking babe dancing on a hill distracting the enemy, while the other troops sneak up on them.
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