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Thread: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    I don't agree with this decision, but that does not matter, it is already decided. However, I anticipate CNN Breaking News items to sporadically flash across the TV telling me about a distressed woman in combat, or one that has been sexually assaulted, likely even by one of our own, and how the military probably isn't bending perfectly to female combat soldiers needs. There will be lots of angry Anderson Cooper/Piers Morgan moments in which they criticize men, the military, and America. It will be a great moment for equality, indeed. All other considerations are null and void, apparently.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    Improving from a 2 to a 4 means nothing when a 80 is required of you. Besides, the army isn't a place for social experiments. Square peg, round hole.
    Of course not....... Integration of blacks and whites not withstanding.... of course not....

    Everyone always says this.... yet it is the military where such "social experiments" always seem to work out just fine.

    Blacks fighting will ruin the army they said.....
    Women serving with men in support roles will ruin the army they said....
    Gays will ruin the army they said......
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Of course not....... Integration of blacks and whites not withstanding.... of course not....

    Everyone always says this.... yet it is the military where such "social experiments" always seem to work out just fine.

    Blacks fighting will ruin the army they said.....
    Women serving with men in support roles will ruin the army they said....
    Gays will ruin the army they said......
    The first only has merit as long as there is discrimination against blacks, which is something that changed over time. The third only has merit if it leads to tension and problems within the unit. That one is to be determined. The second has merit because woman are smaller, weaker, have a higher body fat %, and slower then males. The first and third are rooted in social constructions, the second is rooted in biology.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    The first only has merit as long as there is discrimination against blacks, which is something that changed over time. The third only has merit if it leads to tension and problems within the unit. That one is to be determined. The second has merit because woman are smaller, weaker, have a higher body fat %, and slower then males. The first and third are rooted in social constructions, the second is rooted in biology.
    The difference is that not all males are the same..... not all females are the same.....

    There are females that are more tough than I am.... I ain't gonna sit here and try to act all badass. Its the truth.... And I served in an airborne infantry unit for 4 years with two deployments to Iraq during the early years 2003/2004/2005.

    Claiming someone to be incapable of something purely based upon their gender is just ****ing ignorant.
    Claiming someone to be capable of something purely based upon their gender is also just ****ing ignorant.


    Stick to beliving in funny MEMEs that talk about women making sandwiches for grunts on the frontlines....



    And let the Army figure out how to get this to work on their own.
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    The difference is that not all males are the same..... not all females are the same.....

    There are females that are more tough than I am.... I ain't gonna sit here and try to act all badass. Its the truth.... And I served in an airborne infantry unit for 4 years with two deployments to Iraq during the early years 2003/2004/2005.

    Claiming someone to be incapable of something purely based upon their gender is just ****ing ignorant.
    Claiming someone to be capable of something purely based upon their gender is also just ****ing ignorant.


    Stick to beliving in funny MEMEs that talk about women making sandwiches for grunts on the frontlines....



    And let the Army figure out how to get this to work on their own.
    You make a good point. So let me settle this in a way that I think we both can agree on. The army sets physical standards that are the same for everyone regardless of gender/race/sexuality, and only those who meet those standards can qualify. That means the same number of pullups, the same height/weight requirements, the same number of pushups, and the same obstacle course times, everything.

    Fair?

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by ReformCollege View Post
    You make a good point. So let me settle this in a way that I think we both can agree on. The army sets physical standards that are the same for everyone regardless of gender/race/sexuality, and only those who meet those standards can qualify. That means the same number of pullups, the same height/weight requirements, the same number of pushups, and the same obstacle course times, everything.

    Fair?
    Sure....Sounds good.

    Speaking of the physical fitness requirements...
    Since when did army combat MOSs have their own fitness standards
    Since when are obstacle course times a part of the physical fitness testing standards?
    "I condemn the ideology of White Supremacy and Nazism. They are thugs, criminals, and repugnant, and are against what I believe to be "The American Way" "
    Thus my obligatory condemnation of White supremacy will now be in every post, lest I be accused of supporting it because I didn't mention it specifically every time I post.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Sure....Sounds good.

    Speaking of the physical fitness requirements...
    Since when did army combat MOSs have their own fitness standards
    Since when are obstacle course times a part of the physical fitness testing standards?
    I do remember when I was in, sometime ago, the 82nd had different standards. I also know, some men didn't meet them and stayed in the 82nd.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Pilot View Post
    Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles | World news | guardian.co.uk


    Personally, I'm fine with this as long as they physical requirements are the same. If you can't lift enough or run long enough, you're putting other people in extra danger as well as yourself.
    I agree.As long as the physicaly requirements are the same women should be allowed to serve in combat roles. If a 17-21 year old man has to do 42 push ups to get a 60% on the APFT, then a 17-21 year old woman should have to do 42 push ups to get a 60% on the APFT and those push ups should be the same quality.nothing should be dumbed down.Dumbing down standards will put combat troops at risk.

    But they are not going to keep standards the same.So I do not think women should be allowed in combat roles.
    Gen. Dempsey: If Women Can
    Gen. Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said Thursday that with women now eligible to fill combat roles in the military, commanders must justify why any woman might be excluded – and, if women can’t meet any unit’s standard, the Pentagon will ask: “Does it really have to be that high?”
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    I agree.As long as the physicaly requirements are the same women should be allowed to serve in combat roles. If a 17-21 year old man has to do 42 push ups to get a 60% on the APFT, then a 17-21 year old woman should have to do 42 push ups to get a 60% on the APFT and those push ups should be the same quality.nothing should be dumbed down.Dumbing down standards will put combat troops at risk.

    But they are not going to keep standards the same.So I do not think women should be allowed in combat roles.
    Gen. Dempsey: If Women Can
    Gen. Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said Thursday that with women now eligible to fill combat roles in the military, commanders must justify why any woman might be excluded – and, if women can’t meet any unit’s standard, the Pentagon will ask: “Does it really have to be that high?”
    If you can't say yes, because and show the rationale to be sound, should the standard be there?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Pentagon to overturn ban on women in military combat roles

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    If you can't say yes, because and show the rationale to be sound, should the standard be there?
    What?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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