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Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to cla

Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Fiddytree said:
I used to be annoyed at that, like in the novel Babbit...until I came to think that eventually, I had a perverse sense of admiration for the hypocrisy. Then I later found out I didn't admire them so much as I was more interested in understanding power structures, just usually without the zeal to overturn them (which seemed to be the only way people wanted to learn about it). When you find out that some things aren't "fair," you're expected to freak out and throw a revolution and then get bitterly disappointed when you find out it doesn't work that way either.
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Didn't you say you were disabled? Before ADA and other such laws that began to be enacted in the 1970s, the same excuses were used to justify firing this teacher (the distraction) could have been used to discriminate against you. Thank the people who fought to change those attitudes, not ones who just turned their heads and said "some things aren't 'fair.'"
 
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Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

ecofarm said:
Haha

If people are trying to screw you over, the truth is off the table and outright deception is fine. - Hard Truth.
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Am I the only one that spots the irony of the use of the term "screw you over" in the defense of a woman who made her living by screwing people?:2razz:
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Jack Fabulous said:
It absolutely would.

If it wasn't true, when little Johny comes home from school and tells his mother that his teacher used to be a porn star his mom can tell him that she really wasn't. She just happens to look like a woman who made porn. She can then proceed to kick his little ass for looking at porn and take away his internet privileges. With a little luck, little Johny would learn a valuable lesson about false allegations and spreading lies. But that can't happen in this case because his teacher REALLY IS adult film star Tiffany Six.:shock:
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How would the mother know if its true or not?
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

ecofarm said:
Haha

If people are trying to screw you over, the truth is off the table and outright deception is fine. - Hard Truth.
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You misquoted me intentionally to misrepresent my position. I said "It is OK to lie to people who are only out to screw you over when you have not done anything wrong."

Are you saying you would tell that Nazi you were Jewish?
 
Re: ke porn past, must not return to cla

Hard Truth said:
Didn't you say you were disabled? Before ADA and other such laws that began to be enacted in the 1970s, the same excuses used to justify firing this teacher (the distraction) could have been used to discriminate against you. Thank the people fought to change those attitudes, not ones who just turned their heads and said "some things aren't 'fair.'"
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So a physical/ mental disabilility is like choosing to participate in a widely disseminated pornographic video?
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Hard Truth said:
Didn't you say you were disabled? Before ADA and other such laws that began to be enacted in the 1970s, the same excuses used to justify firing this teacher (the distraction) could have been used to discriminate against you. Thank the people fought to change those attitudes, not ones who just turned their heads and said "some things aren't 'fair.'"
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Yes, and in fact, if you wanted to look even closer, there was a disabled American historian by the name of Paul K. Longmore that wrote an essay on that in his book Why I Burned my Book. The difference was that there wasn't this really immature shock and ignorance about the profession, but rather a hard-nosed realization that became an attack on all fronts, social, legal, political, and pedagogically.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Hard Truth said:
If you were in Nazi Germany and were asked if you were a Jew, wouldn't you lie if you were? It is OK to lie to people who are only out to screw you over when you have not done anything wrong.
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Self-serving stretch of an analogy. She doesn't live in Nazi Germany, she lied to get a job, she got caught in the lie. She doesn't lose her life, she loses the job she gained on false pretenses.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Hard Truth said:
You misquoted me intentionally to misrepresent my position. I said "It is OK to lie to people who are only out to screw you over when you have not done anything wrong."
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I left off that last part. I found it redundant given the presumption of being "screwed over".

Are you saying you would tell that Nazi you were Jewish?
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For argument's sake, let's say 'yes'. Then what.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Kal'Stang said:
Community standards allowed for such things as segregation, miscegation, slavery, and wars. Sorry but right is right and wrong is wrong. Just because the majority of people may think something is wrong does not mean that it actually and in reality IS wrong.
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At odds with the specific context my use of that term addressed. My use of "community standards" in this context refers to the SCOTUS decision on pornography.
 
Re: ke porn past, must not return to cla

Dr. Chuckles said:
So a physical/ mental disabilility is like choosing to participate in a widely disseminated pornographic video?
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No, but where he's getting at is that academically, does my socially scandalized, say, physical disability (as was the case with Longmore), prevent me from being a qualified educator. Longmore wasn't accused of being immoral, but rather just intellectually or physically incapable.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Kal'Stang said:
Hence why background checks are done. Surely you don't rely entirely on what is on the application for such things?

You're arguement has become one of criminal liability instead of just past work history.
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My argument has always been that I do not believe a woman who's worked in porn films is suitable to teach middle school. I believe, from the article, that a second part of the "problem" was that she omitted that tidbit on her employment application. Not all companies run background checks. Any company that doesn't, at the very least, get credible answers about a gap in employment history is nutz.

I'm not going to continue arguing this point. It's done and over . . . unless the union steps in. The gal lost her job. I think she should have. You, of course, can believe whatever you'd like.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Hard Truth said:
How would the mother know if its true or not?
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I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that if there was an allegation that a school teacher was previously a porn star that there would be a few questions asked. I'm also fairly certain that a teacher who was accused of being a porn star would be able to prove those allegations false rather quickly... and would WANT to do so very quickly. I'm also fairly certain that any concerned parents would be informed of the truth.

But this is all real world stuff, here. In fantasy land these situations don't really matter because a career in porn has equal merits to a career in pretty much anything else.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

clownboy said:
At odds with the specific context my use of that term addressed. My use of "community standards" in this context refers to the SCOTUS decision on pornography.
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Doesn't mean that they were right.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Jack Fabulous said:
In fantasy land these situations don't really matter because a career in porn has equal merits to a career in pretty much anything else.
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No, sorry. It doesn't have anywhere near "equal merits." Those who would like to destroy our social mores may wish to believe that it does. But, as yet, it does not.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

ecofarm said:
I left off that last part. I found it redundant given the presumption of being "screwed over".



For argument's sake, let's say 'yes'. Then what.
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I would admire your commitment to honesty, but think you are insane.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

MaggieD said:
My argument has always been that I do not believe a woman who's worked in porn films is suitable to teach middle school. I believe, from the article, that a second part of the "problem" was that she omitted that tidbit on her employment application. Not all companies run background checks. Any company that doesn't, at the very least, get credible answers about a gap in employment history is nutz.
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Schools are required to do background checks so thats kind of moot here.

MaggieD said:
I'm not going to continue arguing this point. It's done and over . . . unless the union steps in. The gal lost her job. I think she should have. You, of course, can believe whatever you'd like.
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The appeals process isn't done. She can still file for another appeal. But if you're done then so be it. Tis your perogative. ;) :)
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

MaggieD said:
No, sorry. It doesn't have anywhere near "equal merits." Those who would like to destroy our social mores may wish to believe that it does. But, as yet, it does not.
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Who's social mores? Your's? Mine? Wait no..not mine...I have no problem with someone having a past in pornography.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

MaggieD said:
No, sorry. It doesn't have anywhere near "equal merits." Those who would like to destroy our social mores may wish to believe that it does. But, as yet, it does not.
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I want to destroy those social mores that are based on bigotry and an irrational fear of unconventional sexuality.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

MaggieD said:
No, sorry. It doesn't have anywhere near "equal merits." Those who would like to destroy our social mores may wish to believe that it does. But, as yet, it does not.
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I said "in fantasy land" it has equal merits but not in the real world which you and I live in.;)
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Hard Truth said:
I want to destroy those social mores that are based on bigotry and an irrational fear of unconventional sexuality.
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I'll be the one to teach my kids about "unconventional sexuality", if you don't mind...
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

ChrisL said:
Good Lord! It's completely different to lie about something to save your LIFE than it is to lie to get a job. :lamo
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If you lose your job, can't you end up homeless and starving at one point?

Especially if its yoir career?
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Kal'Stang said:
Doesn't mean that they were right.
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Of course it doesn't, but there are two types of "right". The sort that is believed to be so by the individual, and the one held by the majority of the group. The latter controls what is, or is not, right in the eyes of our law.

This mirrors the community standards decision made by the SCOTUS. Also in this decision, where the community standard (that is not in conflict with the state or federal constitution or law) was used to find her guilty of a morals clause violation.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

Kal'Stang said:
Who's social mores? Your's? Mine? Wait no..not mine...I have no problem with someone having a past in pornography.
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And in your community the majority may feel the same as you. Thus you elect school board officials who don't put a prohibition against that in their morals clause. If this incident happened in such a community, they may have excused that she lied to gain employment, or maybe not.

But in the community where this happened, folks DO have a problem with something you don't.
 
Re: Judges say Calif. middle school teacher can't shake porn past, must not return to

The answer seems obvious to me. Let her teach Sex Ed.
 
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