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Thread: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

  1. #101
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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Like the Democrats did as you so gleefully pointed out about 10 minutes ago?
    Now you're distorting history. It was not "the democrats" who did that and then folded. It was "a small minority of dems"

    Since you've been such a stickler for accuracy (in this thread), I'm sure you weren't trying to dishonestly claim that when a small minority of dems do something, it's the same as when an overwhelming majority of repubs do it.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
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    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by Kushinator View Post
    Financially driven recessions precipitated by trillions upon trillions of dollars in wealth losses tend to be the most difficult to circumnavigate. I am not here to make excuses for a stimulus package that lacked the size and velocity (for reasons that require a different type of discussion) to deal with the loss of economic output.
    So Obama didn't spend enough with his failed Stimulus Package? Bwahahahaha ....

    Let's have the discussion. Where did Obama get the money for his failed stimulus? Come on Economic Genius. Tell us all where Obama got that 787B where billions was given to his campaign bundlers and wasted on failed "Green Jobs" which cost in some cases as much as 10 million PER JOB.

    Nope! People who lose their jobs cannot afford to support their local retailers and wholesalers at levels necessary to keep said retailers and wholesalers from reducing their labor costs. Fact: You balance the budget today and the U.S. goes into a deeper recession than in 2007-2009 as $1 trillion leaves the economy.
    Who claimed that? Strawman much? Where did I claim only people who are on welfare shop at retail stores? Why don't you try addressing the actual facts instead of tap dancing around the issue like a sideshow clown. People who are on welfare primarily spend money on commodities. Gas/Food/ect. There is no productivity/wealth creation associated with their income. NO NET GAIN. It's a WASH. They are not contributing any productivity to the Economy with labor. Otherwise the Government would just pay everyone infinite unemployment not to work and shop at Walmart. You're an economic illiterate.

    Nonsense. Money is flowing from the capital markets into the U.S. Treasury which is used to pay for government expenditures of goods and services. Remove this money, and those who once received these payments for providing goods and services will be at a rather large shortfall. And what would the natural response be? To cut labor costs of course, thereby creating even greater loss of jobs.
    Again, this is a laughable and you completely missed the point and dodged the issue. You are admitting Government received it's money from Private Wealth creation and doesn't generate wealth on it's own. It's receiving more than 2 trillion annually actually. Obama is illegally spending at TARP level of expenditures going on 4 years. The Government already is taking in enough to pay the debt service. So there goes that strawman. Obama doesn't need to raise the debt ceiling to service the debt. The only reason why Obama wants to raise the debt is so he can expand the Welfare State.

    Secondly you are completely ignoring the negative externalities and opportunity costs associated with removing that private capital from the hands of those who would invest it far more wisely than a Federal Government that is wasting 125B a year on "improper payments". Your entire fallacy rests on the notion that somehow the Government is a better investment banker than the Private Sector. That's radical idealism. Not Economics.

    Improper Payment Progress | The White House

    Now, because many of the targeted programs - such as Unemployment Insurance and Medicaid - are paying out more benefits as the economic downturn creates more demand for these benefits, the total number paid out in improper payments increased to $125 billion last fiscal year even though the overall error rate declined. This is an unfortunate result of the recession and of basic math: the more that is paid out, the more paid out in error even if the overall rate declines.
    You are stuck within a cult of Hope and Change. You're defending a man who just spent millions of our money on a vacation in Hawaii. It would be comical if it wasn't so pathetic.

  3. #103
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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I don't remember anyone in this thread saying that this is something only repubs do
    Iguanaman just got done implying that very thing, homey.

  4. #104
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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Now you're distorting history. It was not "the democrats" who did that and then folded. It was "a small minority of dems"

    Since you've been such a stickler for accuracy (in this thread), I'm sure you weren't trying to dishonestly claim that when a small minority of dems do something, it's the same as when an overwhelming majority of repubs do it.
    Small minority? Perhaps you should define how many (few) it takes to make a small minority.



    That vote went 52-48 if I remember accurately.

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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. … Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that “the buck stops here.” Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better." --- Senator Barrack Obama
    Nice try, mac. I already called Obama a hypocrite in another thread. Keep up, please. And learn to spell the president's name ffs, that's just embarrassing.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    I called Obama a hypocrite in a thread once, so please excuse my Obama worship in every other thread I post in
    Fixed

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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    What is different is the threat of default, a dangerous game that puts the entire worlds economy in jeopardy and will increase what we owe.
    There was NO threat of default because Obama said that Bush's deficits were horrible, Which they were.
    If you can't see that that is different, then you are blind.
    So basically none of the things he said before don't apply to now...the only difference is he was free to spout political rhetoric and what he believed to be true because everyone else was going to vote differently then him, and now more people agree with him and thus his stance is wrong?

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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by a351 View Post
    Those decisions would ultimately lie with the Treasury. Ultimately, once key assets were likely auctioned off, debt obligations that exceed immediate tax revenue would go unfulfilled absent a increase in debt authority.
    Ah....so there wouldn't automatically be a defaulting on our debts, nor any decision by the congress to default on our debts, but rather if multiple other actions AFTER the fact occurred in a specific way THEN it may do so. In which case, those other decisions are responsible, since there were other action that could be taken AFTER not raising the debt ceiling that wouldn't cause us to not pay our debt.

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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Actually, Democrats have threatened to hold the debt limit hostage | WashingtonExaminer.com

    I'm always amazed at how partisanship seems to affect memory.
    Congress voted to raise the debt ceiling, and all the Democratic senators except Bayh went along. But the bottom line is, it is simply not a new thing for members of Congress to attempt to attach policy proposals to debt ceiling legislation — and even for members of the majority party to threaten to vote against it if they don’t get what they want.
    Sorry but that was such a non-event, it took a lot of digging to find I bet. You are not comparing that to the House T's insistance that a default would be OK with them? I didn't not hear that from ANY Democrat. Not voting for something you know will pass anyway is not like a minority in Washington holding the country hostage until they get what they want. That is totally unprecedented and unacceptable.
    They will back out or suffer the consequences in 2014.

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    re: Obama chides GOP on debt limit: 'We are not a deadbeat nation'

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Ah....so there wouldn't automatically be a defaulting on our debts, nor any decision by the congress to default on our debts, but rather if multiple other actions AFTER the fact occurred in a specific way THEN it may do so. In which case, those other decisions are responsible, since there were other action that could be taken AFTER not raising the debt ceiling that wouldn't cause us to not pay our debt.
    What are you trying to argue? That a refusal to raise the debt ceiling would force the government to balance the budget?
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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