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Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standard

Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

Shadow Serious said:
How many (legally) in New York or Chicago though?
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From those I know in Chicago, I'd guess quite a bit.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

Boo Radley said:
From those I know in Chicago, I'd guess quite a bit.
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And of those in Chicago do they have a permit or do they do so without one?
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

Shadow Serious said:
And of those in Chicago do they have a permit or do they do so without one?
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Those I know are legal.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

iguanaman said:
The # of murders committed with hammers is inconsequential. I don't see your point.
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More people are murdered with hammer/maces then with guns.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

Shadow Serious said:
More people are murdered with hammer/maces then with guns.
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I would to see where that stat is coming from.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

Liberals are a funny bunch, consider this, many of them here has argued for the legalization of all drugs, now they argue for the banning of guns, yet drugs legal and illegal in 2009 killed more people then auto accidents I believe it was 36,000 people dies of just drug overdoses in the US this doesn’t even take into consideration of deaths due to drug deals gone bad,

You just have to wonder where peoples heads are when they are in favor of legalization of something that is now illegal and causing 36,000 deaths a year, and whining and crying about something that is legal .. That the latest number I can find caused about 9,000 deaths per year ..

Just another case where it shows liberals don’t really give a **** about anything but their own political agenda . It reads like this .. Hey so what if 36,000 people died from drugs .. We want to give them more so what if a few thousand more die? We want drugs legalized. Now guns we don’t like them, so lets make them illegal .. Even tho gun deaths in the US has been declining over the years .

Liberals bitch and complain that look at the war on drugs, how it’s failed, how much it costs, then want to start a war on guns …. I guess it never enters their small minds that the war on guns will be just as ineffective, and just as costly if not more so then the war on drugs …. As I said they really don’t give a damn about anything “EXCEPT” their social agenda … it’s basically f**k the deaths or the cost as long as they get what they want.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

The Barbarian said:
Liberals are a funny bunch, consider this, many of them here has argued for the legalization of all drugs, now they argue for the banning of guns, yet drugs but legal and illegal in 2009 killed more people then auto accidents I believe it was 36,000 people dies of just drug overdoses in the US this doesn’t even take into consideration of deaths due to drug deals gone bad,

You just have to wonder where peoples heads are when they are in favor of legalization of something that is now illegal and causing 36,000 deaths a year, and whining and crying about something that is legal .. That the latest number I can find caused about 9,000 deaths per year ..

Just another case where it shows liberals don’t really give a **** about anything but their own political agenda . It reads like this .. Hey so what if 36,000 people died from drugs .. We want to give them more so what if a few thousand more die? We want drugs legalized. Now guns we don’t like them, so lets make them illegal .. Even tho gun deaths in the US has been declining over the years .

Liberals bitch and complain that look at the war on drugs, how it’s failed, how much it costs, then want to start a war on guns …. I guess it never enters their small minds that the war on guns will be just as ineffective, and just as costly if not more so then the war on drugs …. As I said they really don’t give a damn about anything “EXCEPT” their social agenda … it’s basically f**k the deaths or the cost as long as they get what they want.
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Drugs have been the cause of death when both legal and illegal. But, a point here is conservatives suffer from the same inconsistency in reverse if we're going to deal with this stereotypically as opposed to arguments actually presented here.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

Boo Radley said:
Drugs have been the cause of death when both legal and illegal. But, a point here is conservatives suffer from the same inconsistency in reverse if we're going to deal with this stereotypically as opposed to arguments actually presented here.
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laughs as usual you said nothing at all .... do you deny that gun deaths in the US have been dropping in past years ??? Do you deny that drug related deaths in the US have been on the rise in the past years ???

36,000 deaths by drugs .... 9,000 death by guns .... which problem seems to be bigger to you ??
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

The Barbarian said:
laughs as usual you said nothing at all .... do you deny that gun deaths in the US have been dropping in past years ??? Do you deny that drug related deaths in the US have been on the rise in the past years ???

36,000 deaths by drugs .... 9,000 death by guns .... which problem seems to be bigger to you ??
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I dispute that either is meaningful in the way you present it. One needless death is wrong no matter how many other needless deaths you come up with. And we are not limited to tackling just one issue either.

You also skipped the point altogether.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

Boo Radley said:
I dispute that either is meaningful in the way you present it. One needless death is wrong no matter how many other needless deaths you come up with. And we are not limited to tackling just one issue either.

You also skipped the point altogether.
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The point being is liberals aren’t concerned with the 36,000 deaths .. Shown in the fact that they want to legalize more drugs … . Adding to those death tolls ..

Where as they are more concerned about 9000 deaths .. . That has been declining over the years .. To a point where everything else is being put on hold … and most liberals including yourself .. Want to start another war .. .a war on guns … do you in all honesty think it’s going to be any more effective .. Or less costly then the war on drugs ?

Of course I don’t expect a reason answer from someone like you . . Because all you can do is hold onto the talking points of your liberal social values
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

The Barbarian said:
The point being is liberals aren’t concerned with the 36,000 deaths .. Shown in the fact that they want to legalize more drugs … . Adding to those death tolls ..

Where as they are more concerned about 9000 deaths .. . That has been declining over the years .. To a point where everything else is being put on hold … and most liberals including yourself .. Want to start another war .. .a war on guns … do you in all honesty think it’s going to be any more effective .. Or less costly then the war on drugs ?

Of course I don’t expect a reason answer from someone like you . . Because all you can do is hold onto the talking points of your liberal social values
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That's hogwash, just as the reverse would have been (your still missing the point).

And I want no war at all. It is really important to pay attention.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

Both the war on drugs, and the (imminent) war on guns will be failures.

Prohibition never works.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

The Barbarian said:
The point being is liberals aren’t concerned with the 36,000 deaths .. Shown in the fact that they want to legalize more drugs … . Adding to those death tolls ..

Where as they are more concerned about 9000 deaths .. . That has been declining over the years .. To a point where everything else is being put on hold … and most liberals including yourself .. Want to start another war .. .a war on guns … do you in all honesty think it’s going to be any more effective .. Or less costly then the war on drugs ?

Of course I don’t expect a reason answer from someone like you . . Because all you can do is hold onto the talking points of your liberal social values
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Was it the "liberal social values" that established an entire department (homeland security) in response to a relatively miniscule quantity of deaths (from terrorism)?

It's not improper to respond to problems facing our nation. If we can fix something, we should. If we can prevent something, we should. We should act, but not overreact. And until folks on both side get closer to the middle, we're not going to have a productive argument, just Mr. Panic vs. Mr. Oblivious.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

StringBean said:
Both the war on drugs, and the (imminent) war on guns will be failures.

Prohibition never works.
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someone had a great post a few weeks ago-had some stoner chick and it said

She smokes dope

she thinks gun bans will disarm criminals
 
Firstly, this discussion is on gun control, not drugs. Secondly, governmental control of the distribution of guns has been proven to work in places like the UK. Also, just because there are deaths for other reasons than gun violence doesn't mean that it's an issue to overlook. The simple fact of the matter is that thousands of people a year are dying from a completely preventable cause, and this is only because a minority of the American people like to collect assault weapons.
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

AcrosstheAisle said:
Firstly, this discussion is on gun control, not drugs. Secondly, governmental control of the distribution of guns has been proven to work in places like the UK. Also, just because there are deaths for other reasons than gun violence doesn't mean that it's an issue to overlook. The simple fact of the matter is that thousands of people a year are dying from a completely preventable cause, and this is only because a minority of the American people like to collect assault weapons.
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Moronic post alert. people collecting "assault weapons" are not the reasons why we have so many murders-mainly in areas where such weapons are not legal (BTW WTH is an assault weapon)
 
The murders and high crime rates in urban areas, specifically those concerning gun violence, are not directly related to gun collectors and the NRA. The point that I made in the last post was that criminals (which have nothing to do with them) can obtain these weapons because of the NRA's resistance to restrictions on the sale of guns. Since polls recently have shown that a majority of Americans support restrictions on the buying of guns (most specifically assault rifles), it seems that allowing this to go on is not in the public's interest.

Also, it was important to the Founding Fathers to have a well-armed/regulated militia, hence the 2nd amendment. However, in today's time, we have an incredibly large, well-armed, and well-regulated military, rendering the idea of a militia useless. While I realize that hunting is very important to some Americans, it is with that I say to place restrictions on concealed guns and assault rifles since those contribute to it the homicide rates the most. There is more justification for owning a hunting rifle than an AR-15 or Walther P99. I believe that, from a societal standpoint, it would be beneficiary to place these restrictions.
 
Boo Radley said:
Drugs have been the cause of death when both legal and illegal. But, a point here is conservatives suffer from the same inconsistency in reverse if we're going to deal with this stereotypically as opposed to arguments actually presented here.
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Yes, actually the number of people that die by legal drugs is somewhere around 250k per year, in other words your dr is more likely to (unintentionally) kill you than cancer.

Next, you are around 80 times more likely to be saved by a gun owner than killed by one, and more than Half the time guns stop / prevent crime it's done without firing a shot.

Yes, the left and right are both horribly corrupt and the vast majority in the house and congress have no concerns of the people they are intended to represent. Which, the left would never admit, is the stronger argument for a well armed society.
 
Boo Radley said:
I dispute that either is meaningful in the way you present it. One needless death is wrong no matter how many other needless deaths you come up with. And we are not limited to tackling just one issue either.

You also skipped the point altogether.
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Ya, about 70-80% of those 9000 deaths are gang related... That's gangs killing gangs.

Yes, and since people are going to cause needless death with or without guns, and so, had you not approached this short sightedly, the rate of murders with knives an hammers will just increase.

The point you missed was the one of getting priorities straight, you should ban hammers based on your logic long before you ban guns.

So, by banning guns you will prevent people from being able to defend themselves against criminals, and I'd say a death as a victim of crime is more needless than the death of the criminal commuting the crime... And even then, leaving the good citizens with Guns does not guarantee that the criminals won't still win in some encounters, but why not allow them to increase the odds??
 
AcrosstheAisle said:
Firstly, this discussion is on gun control, not drugs. Secondly, governmental control of the distribution of guns has been proven to work in places like the UK. Also, just because there are deaths for other reasons than gun violence doesn't mean that it's an issue to overlook. The simple fact of the matter is that thousands of people a year are dying from a completely preventable cause, and this is only because a minority of the American people like to collect assault weapons.
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Ya, it's brought to light just how corrupt the uk is at tracking violent crime, it turns out their stats are based on CONVICTIONS where the us tracks the numbers of crimes committed.

The uk violent crime stat have been increasing without guns faster than the us is seeing crime decrease as millions of new guns have been bought by citizens.

The issue is the violence, not the weapon used engaging in violent acts, people will use ANYTHING as a weapon...
 
Boo Radley said:
That's hogwash, just as the reverse would have been (your still missing the point).

And I want no war at all. It is really important to pay attention.
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Get this through your head though, before you push to hard for gun control: if you make the laws prohibitively difficult to get guns, then the guns will move through the black market. Also, people will fight back at any confiscation, and if only 1% fights back, well, what else would you call a million plus people with guns intent on keeping them?? I'd call it a war.
 
StringBean said:
Both the war on drugs, and the (imminent) war on guns will be failures.

Prohibition never works.
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Yes, and if you can't even keep drugs out of a prison, how are you going to eliminate it from society?

The same will go with guns, except that since guns are easier to find, the result will more than likely turn to a bloodbath.

And based on historical precedence, once citizens are banned their use of guns there typically is a bloodbath (hitler - 40-60 million, Stalin 40-50million, Mao 60-80million).
 
Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

BmanMcfly said:
Get this through your head though, before you push to hard for gun control: if you make the laws prohibitively difficult to get guns, then the guns will move through the black market. Also, people will fight back at any confiscation, and if only 1% fights back, well, what else would you call a million plus people with guns intent on keeping them?? I'd call it a war.
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I may be wrong, and I am definitely no BO fan, but I don't think he is actually stupid enough to call for confiscation.
 
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