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Thread: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standard

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    Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standard

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I dispute that either is meaningful in the way you present it. One needless death is wrong no matter how many other needless deaths you come up with. And we are not limited to tackling just one issue either.

    You also skipped the point altogether.
    Ya, about 70-80% of those 9000 deaths are gang related... That's gangs killing gangs.

    Yes, and since people are going to cause needless death with or without guns, and so, had you not approached this short sightedly, the rate of murders with knives an hammers will just increase.

    The point you missed was the one of getting priorities straight, you should ban hammers based on your logic long before you ban guns.

    So, by banning guns you will prevent people from being able to defend themselves against criminals, and I'd say a death as a victim of crime is more needless than the death of the criminal commuting the crime... And even then, leaving the good citizens with Guns does not guarantee that the criminals won't still win in some encounters, but why not allow them to increase the odds??

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    Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standard

    Quote Originally Posted by AcrosstheAisle View Post
    Firstly, this discussion is on gun control, not drugs. Secondly, governmental control of the distribution of guns has been proven to work in places like the UK. Also, just because there are deaths for other reasons than gun violence doesn't mean that it's an issue to overlook. The simple fact of the matter is that thousands of people a year are dying from a completely preventable cause, and this is only because a minority of the American people like to collect assault weapons.
    Ya, it's brought to light just how corrupt the uk is at tracking violent crime, it turns out their stats are based on CONVICTIONS where the us tracks the numbers of crimes committed.

    The uk violent crime stat have been increasing without guns faster than the us is seeing crime decrease as millions of new guns have been bought by citizens.

    The issue is the violence, not the weapon used engaging in violent acts, people will use ANYTHING as a weapon...

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    Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standard

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    That's hogwash, just as the reverse would have been (your still missing the point).

    And I want no war at all. It is really important to pay attention.
    Get this through your head though, before you push to hard for gun control: if you make the laws prohibitively difficult to get guns, then the guns will move through the black market. Also, people will fight back at any confiscation, and if only 1% fights back, well, what else would you call a million plus people with guns intent on keeping them?? I'd call it a war.

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    Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standard

    Quote Originally Posted by StringBean View Post
    Both the war on drugs, and the (imminent) war on guns will be failures.

    Prohibition never works.
    Yes, and if you can't even keep drugs out of a prison, how are you going to eliminate it from society?

    The same will go with guns, except that since guns are easier to find, the result will more than likely turn to a bloodbath.

    And based on historical precedence, once citizens are banned their use of guns there typically is a bloodbath (hitler - 40-60 million, Stalin 40-50million, Mao 60-80million).

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    Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    Get this through your head though, before you push to hard for gun control: if you make the laws prohibitively difficult to get guns, then the guns will move through the black market. Also, people will fight back at any confiscation, and if only 1% fights back, well, what else would you call a million plus people with guns intent on keeping them?? I'd call it a war.
    I may be wrong, and I am definitely no BO fan, but I don't think he is actually stupid enough to call for confiscation.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

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    Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standard

    Quote Originally Posted by DVSentinel View Post
    I may be wrong, and I am definitely no BO fan, but I don't think he is actually stupid enough to call for confiscation.
    You are right. Probably not yet... If there's another shooting or two on his watch, you can bet what is about to be put into executive order will be deemed "not enough".

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    Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    You are right. Probably not yet... If there's another shooting or two on his watch, you can bet what is about to be put into executive order will be deemed "not enough".
    Maybe. He has already done a lot to hang this on Biden. Making it clear to all that if someone out there wanted to take him out, Biden would be holding the pen for executive orders. But then again, if he really does want to cause a crises that lets him enact emergency powers and suspend the constitution, calling for confiscation would very likely have that affect.

    I don't think he will go that far, but then, I have been wrong before.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

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    Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    Yes, actually the number of people that die by legal drugs is somewhere around 250k per year, in other words your dr is more likely to (unintentionally) kill you than cancer.

    Next, you are around 80 times more likely to be saved by a gun owner than killed by one, and more than Half the time guns stop / prevent crime it's done without firing a shot.

    Yes, the left and right are both horribly corrupt and the vast majority in the house and congress have no concerns of the people they are intended to represent. Which, the left would never admit, is the stronger argument for a well armed society.
    1. the first paragraph doesn't matter at all to the discussion.

    2. The second is false, factually inaccurate, complete BS.

    3. No Concerns? Even if we don't take that as an absolute, it would be largely incorrect. Nor is it an argument for an armed society. This isn't 1800. You can't own enough weapons to protect yourself from the government, so you better have another plan. I suggest particpating in electing better leaders.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    Ya, about 70-80% of those 9000 deaths are gang related... That's gangs killing gangs.

    Yes, and since people are going to cause needless death with or without guns, and so, had you not approached this short sightedly, the rate of murders with knives an hammers will just increase.

    The point you missed was the one of getting priorities straight, you should ban hammers based on your logic long before you ban guns.

    So, by banning guns you will prevent people from being able to defend themselves against criminals, and I'd say a death as a victim of crime is more needless than the death of the criminal commuting the crime... And even then, leaving the good citizens with Guns does not guarantee that the criminals won't still win in some encounters, but why not allow them to increase the odds??
    You're still trying to make excuses for the statistic. Nor do you seem to be discussing MY logic at all. You seem to be stuck in some loop that has nothing to do with what I'm saying.

    Nor do I see any legislation that prevents you from defending yourself, even with guns.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Biden: Obama Considering 'Executive Order' to Deal With Guns | The Weekly Standar

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    Get this through your head though, before you push to hard for gun control: if you make the laws prohibitively difficult to get guns, then the guns will move through the black market. Also, people will fight back at any confiscation, and if only 1% fights back, well, what else would you call a million plus people with guns intent on keeping them?? I'd call it a war.
    No, I would not call 1% a war, at least not a serious one. Nor am I pushing legislation. I've said I don't care, and that your side lacks support. These are not really debatable. I've also said the courts have allowed for restrictions, so some restrictions can take place. The debate comes in at which ones can be restricted, which will largely depend on the rationale delivered to the courts.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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