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Thread: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

  1. #171
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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    You keep going back to the same song without looking at the least inexpensive way, which is the direct relationship between the doctor and patient. Can we agree on that?
    We have. And I've explained the problem with it, which is the eventual decrease in access. Like I have always said, there are two issues here and not one.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    We have. And I've explained the problem with it, which is the eventual decrease in access. Like I have always said, there are two issues here and not one.
    Okay, we can agree that the cheapest way is the direct relationship between a doctor and patient, with minimal interference from third and fourth parties, correct?

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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Okay, we can agree that the cheapest way is the direct relationship between a doctor and patient, with minimal interference from third and fourth parties, correct?
    Not convinced either way on that, but concede it might be for some items.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I understand the claim and the rational, but often it is a limited view those using it arE looking at. The FACT remains, those countries with UHC pay less. We pay more than anyone. And yes, if we remove third party payers, growing the number without adequate access, we will also pay less, maybe even less than they do. But this is a two sided issue. We're looking to get the best access for the least cost. I think the evidence suggests UHC does that best.
    NO matter how many times we point out the fact that nations with UHC have lower costs, Grant will continue to ignore this fact and insist that UHC must make the costs go up
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    NO matter how many times we point out the fact that nations with UHC have lower costs, Grant will continue to ignore this fact and insist that UHC must make the costs go up
    I completely agree. Living in Germany I've seen how amazing their health care system is, every citizen covered 100% for everything, and the quality is quite impressive. We get all this for half the per capita cost that the US is paying. The only thing I'll say is the special brand of American UHC that's been brewing by Obama and libs is little more than legislation giving more power to big pharma and the medical industry. Obamacare actually is making prices rise, we need to adopt a real UHC program.
    Quote Originally Posted by LowDown View Post
    I've got to say that it is shadenfreudalicious to see the rich and famous fucquewads on the coast suffering from the fires.

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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not convinced either way on that, but concede it might be for some items.
    It has to be because there is no third party involvement. It makes sense, right?

    So perhaps a true 'reform' might have been to enhance and improve the direct relationship between the doctor and the patient. if the patient is paying out of pocket then cost becomes a real factor. If third or fourth parties are paying then cost becomes less of a concern. and eventually no concern whatsoever.

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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    I completely agree. Living in Germany I've seen how amazing their health care system is, every citizen covered 100% for everything, and the quality is quite impressive. We get all this for half the per capita cost that the US is paying. The only thing I'll say is the special brand of American UHC that's been brewing by Obama and libs is little more than legislation giving more power to big pharma and the medical industry. Obamacare actually is making prices rise, we need to adopt a real UHC program.
    Whille I agree with you that Obamas' version leaves much to be desired, it is very similar to the system France uses, and their costs are far below what we have here in the US
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    It has to be because there is no third party involvement. It makes sense, right?

    So perhaps a true 'reform' might have been to enhance and improve the direct relationship between the doctor and the patient. if the patient is paying out of pocket then cost becomes a real factor. If third or fourth parties are paying then cost becomes less of a concern. and eventually no concern whatsoever.
    No, it makes no sense beceause EVERY nation wit UHC has lower costs than we do, a fact you continue to ignore.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  9. #179
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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    It has to be because there is no third party involvement. It makes sense, right?

    So perhaps a true 'reform' might have been to enhance and improve the direct relationship between the doctor and the patient. if the patient is paying out of pocket then cost becomes a real factor. If third or fourth parties are paying then cost becomes less of a concern. and eventually no concern whatsoever.
    If that we're the only factor, you may be right. But as they lose volume, demand becomes less, they have to pamper more, add in the unnecessary test, it is not sure that they will. History suggests we're not really savvy consumers. Especially when it comes to medicine. We love snake oil.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Health care law may mean less hiring in 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    I completely agree. Living in Germany I've seen how amazing their health care system is, every citizen covered 100% for everything, and the quality is quite impressive. We get all this for half the per capita cost that the US is paying. The only thing I'll say is the special brand of American UHC that's been brewing by Obama and libs is little more than legislation giving more power to big pharma and the medical industry. Obamacare actually is making prices rise, we need to adopt a real UHC program.
    Yes, there can be a national health care program but what they have done in the States is pass a bill that few have read, few understand and no one knows the consequences. That is just passing a health bill for the sake of passing a health bill. It's supporters haven't read it either but will defend it only because of their political ideology.

    There has been no debate and very little thought, put into the legislative process and that is not a good thing..

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