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Thread: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    I didn't realize the abortion debate was trivial to you. OK. That's cool. Personally I don't especially give a ****. Of course I recognize that a fetus is not a person, so why the **** should I care?
    What debate? The pro abortion/pro choice people won and abortions are now available everywhere. The debate was lost almost four decades ago.

    That the pro choice people can't even accept something as innocuous as "Choose Life" makes their stridency appear too petty by far.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    What debate? The pro abortion/pro choice people won and abortions are now available everywhere. The debate was lost almost four decades ago.

    That the pro choice people can't even accept something as innocuous as "Choose Life" makes their stridency appear too petty by far.
    Who said it can't be accepted? I don't know if you noticed but the judge did not make his verdict based upon the words "Choose Life". He based his verdict on the fact that one group was allowed to use a state provided public venue while denying that same venue to another group. The denying of that other group the same venue that was allowed another group....THAT is what is unacceptable.

    Would you find it acceptable if the government allowed pro-choice thier own plate while denying it to pro-lifer's? I wouldn't.

    Edit: BTW, just because abortions are available doesn't mean that no one should fight to keep them available. As long as one side fights to suppress freedom then there must needs be a group to oppose them.
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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by H. Lee White View Post
    Judge finds NC ‘Choose Life’ plates unconstitutional | MyFOX8.com

    So.... if NC issued a “Slavery Sucks!” plate, the ACLU would sue if the state does not also offer a “Slavery Rocks!” plate?
    Was a Reagan appointed judge as it turns out.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    The sad fact is that having a pedophile win is better than having a Democrat in office. I'm all for a solution where a Republican gets in that isn't Moore.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Who said it can't be accepted? I don't know if you noticed but the judge did not make his verdict based upon the words "Choose Life". He based his verdict on the fact that one group was allowed to use a state provided public venue while denying that same venue to another group. The denying of that other group the same venue that was allowed another group....THAT is what is unacceptable.

    Would you find it acceptable if the government allowed pro-choice thier own plate while denying it to pro-lifer's? I wouldn't.

    Edit: BTW, just because abortions are available doesn't mean that no one should fight to keep them available. As long as one side fights to suppress freedom then there must needs be a group to oppose them.
    How is the "Choose Life" motto effecting anyone's freedom, and what is it about this message that offends you?

    Aren't pro choice people also pro life? Or are they all pro abortion, that their livelihoods as abortionists, or commissions for women they send to their clinics, might be effected if some woman decides to Choose Life and adopt the baby out?

    This is ridiculous. Life is a good thing for most people. Perhaps not for the Adam Lanza's of this world but certainly for most thinking, caring people. Why not just say so?

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    How is the "Choose Life" motto effecting anyone's freedom, and what is it about this message that offends you?

    Aren't pro choice people also pro life? Or are they all pro abortion, that their livelihoods as abortionists, or commissions for women they send to their clinics, might be effected if some woman decides to Choose Life and adopt the baby out?

    This is ridiculous. Life is a good thing for most people. Perhaps not for the Adam Lanza's of this world but certainly for most thinking, caring people. Why not just say so?
    Do you have a reading comprehension problem? NO ONE IS OFFENDED OR AFFECTED BY THE WORDS CHOOSE LIFE BY ITSELF! Did the bigger words help? I can make them bigger if you want.

    Listen, re-read what I said previously. Try to look at it objectively instead of as if you or your belief system is being insulted. Because its not. What IS offensive is the state government denying access of a public state venue to one group while giving access to that venue to another group. That is a restriction on free speech. If you want to argue that point then argue that point. Stop with this hyperbolic intellectual dishonesty crap. All that it does is hurt your side and makes you look foolish at best.

    Now how much do people want to bet that someone will respond to this post cutting out everything but my first line and making an issue out of it instead of what this case is really about?
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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    What IS offensive is the state government denying access of a public state venue to one group while giving access to that venue to another group.

    What is this other group that is against "Choose Life"? They must be a very strange lot.
    That is a restriction on free speech. If you want to argue that point then argue that point. Stop with this hyperbolic intellectual dishonesty crap. All that it does is hurt your side and makes you look foolish at best.
    My side says "Choose Life", though I am also personally pro choice regarding abortion.

    Intellectual dishonesty is making words appear to mean something they do not. You, and many others, are reading a great deal into the words "Choose Life" instead of just accepting them at face value. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
    Last edited by Grant; 12-15-12 at 10:07 PM.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by H. Lee White View Post
    Judge finds NC ‘Choose Life’ plates unconstitutional | MyFOX8.com

    So.... if NC issued a “Slavery Sucks!” plate, the ACLU would sue if the state does not also offer a “Slavery Rocks!” plate?
    Maybe these special plates were for fans of the 80's group WHAM!

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    My side says "Choose Life", though I am also personally pro choice regarding abortion.

    Intellectual dishonesty is making words appear to mean something they do not. You, and many others, are reading a great deal into the words "Choose Life" instead of just accepting them at face value. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
    Why would we need to "read" anything into those plates? All that we have to do is know who sponsored them and put them up to the NC Legislation and who benefits from those plates. (and by "benefits" I'm talking money) Want to know who that is? Choose Life Inc. Also known as Carolina Pregnancy Care Fellowship.

    For each of those plates sold $15 goes to Carolina Pregnancy Care Fellowship (CPCF) and to top it off those funds are also expressly prohibited from going towards any agency that "provides, promotes, counsels, or refers to abortion". And if you want any more evidence that the CPCF is expressly a pro-life organization then you may read it from thier own website...

    Choose Life

    Carolina Pregnancy Care Fellowship (CPCF) is a statewide, 501(c)3 nonprofit, pro-life organization committed to equip, encourage, and network pregnancy care ministries in North Carolina. Included are pregnancy care centers, adoption agencies and maternity homes
    But we don't have to stop here to find the evidence...

    More about Choose Life Plates

    "North Carolina citizens are simply asking for the opportunity to purchase a license plate with a pro-life message that will provide financial resources to mothers and fathers in the midst of a difficult situation.
    As you can see we don't need to "read" anything into the meaning of those plates. All that we need to do is read the organization website that sponsored the plates legislation in NC.

    So the only intellectual dishonesty going on here is by those "pretending" that those plates are not about the pro-life movement and are not meant to be anti-abortion plates.

    If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it must be a duck.

    BTW, I never said the words "What is this other group that is against "Choose Life"? They must be a very strange lot." that you have attributed to me on the quote in your post with my name.
    Last edited by Kal'Stang; 12-16-12 at 12:25 AM.
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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Why would we need to "read" anything into those plates? All that we have to do is know who sponsored them and put them up to the NC Legislation and who benefits from those plates. (and by "benefits" I'm talking money) Want to know who that is? Choose Life Inc. Also known as Carolina Pregnancy Care Fellowship.
    Who cares who sponsors them? Is it that big a deal.

    For each of those plates sold $15 goes to Carolina Pregnancy Care Fellowship (CPCF) and to top it off those funds are also expressly prohibited from going towards any agency that "provides, promotes, counsels, or refers to abortion". And if you want any more evidence that the CPCF is expressly a pro-life organization then you may read it from thier own website...
    Great! They are pro life. Who isn't?
    But we don't have to stop here to find the evidence...
    As far as I'm concerned, we can, This "evidence" is of no interest to me. I am not fighting a war against any group of people, especially one who is pro life or says "Choose Life" I think these are both important messages despite my being pro choice. Presidents have supported abortion being available but one day might be unnecessary. Saying "Choose Life" might be a step in that direction, and a good one I would say.

    As you can see we don't need to "read" anything into the meaning of those plates. All that we need to do is read the organization website that sponsored the plates legislation in NC.
    Right. A group of people say "Choose Life". Where is your problem with that?

    So the only intellectual dishonesty going on here is by those "pretending" that those plates are not about the pro-life movement and are not meant to be anti-abortion plates.
    What is wrong with a pro life movement or saying Choose Life? Why make enemies out of those who support life? Aren't there larger battles to be fought??

    If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it must be a duck.
    Bring that up when we're discussing ducks.

    BTW, I never said the words "What is this other group that is against "Choose Life"? They must be a very strange lot." that you have attributed to me on the quote in your post with my name.
    That is me who said that. My apologies for poor editing.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    This was a good call. No longer allowing a religious belief on a license plate.
    Alex Carey:

    ... the 20th century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: The growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy.

    Australian social scientist, quoted by Noam Chomsky in World Orders Old and New

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