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Thread: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

  1. #211
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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Precisely my point.

    "Choose life" can mean different things to different people. I'm sure we can all agree that George Michael is different.

    Also, I don't want to know why you remember George Michael (and Wham) sporting a "choose life" t-shirt hahahaha.
    Why waste brain space with useful info when there is so much useless tangent data to process? It is easy to look up the important stuff.....(i.e. I used to watch a lot of VH1 "I love the ...." shows)

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by vendur View Post
    I find it interesting the sort of illogical dualism found in the idea of "you must present the opposing view". There is not a black and white divide on abortion, there are many shades of grey. Who determines the initial meaning, and who chooses what it considered its opposite? You could even argue the "kids first" logo was "pro-life" if you want to dive into the semantics, could you not? What of the intermediary views? People that support limited abortions? What would their logo be? And, again, we determines all this?
    I think these conflicts exits mostly on your side of the keyboard.

    Quote Originally Posted by vendur View Post
    What sort of absurdity is all this? Almost as absurd as the complete ignorance of the constitution by a judge who is nothing more than a leftwing hack and/or someone trying to score political points for some reason or other. Don't bother continuing to yammer about it being anything else.
    He's a Reagan appointee.
    I think it's absurd how quickly things devolve into an attempt to discredit someone rather than dealing with the issues at hand. But that's just me.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    Please cite the law created by the North Carolina legislature that prevents and punishes, by law, the issuing of pro-abortion statements.
    One second you are babbling about constitutional law and now you are asking about a state law?? Can you ever stay on topic??

    I don't have to find a state law because this issue is about the constitution.. You do know that is federal law don't you?? Which trumps state?? The ruling was about the constitution and not state law..

    Come on Jay.. Get with the program here..

    Government entities are not protected under free speech.. Having said that, in this case, the free speech of the people is violated when both views of this issue are not equally voiced..

    This is why it is very dangerous for the government to get involved in political propaganda..

    You are just pissed off because this is an issue you agree with and you can't stand it that a ruling has been made against your views.. Well.. You conservatives claim you want to live by the constitution.. So live by it.. Nuff said..
    Last edited by DemonMyst; 12-13-12 at 11:55 AM.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    Not really, no. The government may not abridge freedom of speech. If they made a law saying pro-abortionists could not talk about their odious, barbaric views, then the state government would be violating the first amendment. Otherwise, nah.
    So it'd be cool in your opinion, if the gov provided access to a public venue in which only the "pro-abortionist" view was allowed? They wouldn't be banning non-"pro-abortionist" expression of views.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Even if it was "propaganda" it shouldn't be banned because it breaks no law, nor does it violate the constitution.

    I'm pro-life but I don't understand why anyone would want a plate that reads "choose life" when you can just buy a bumper sticker that says that. However there is no legal reason why someone shouldn't have the right to have a plate that reads that.

    In order to make such a ruling a judge would have to conclude that everyone who is pro-life is religious and that is not true. The judge may as well say all atheists must be pro-choice.... The judge made an idiotic and misguided ruling here and it will certainly be overturned.

    Besides, "choose life" could mean a lot of things from abortions to individuals who had a drug or alcohol addiction and became sober or to some who are just happy to be alive... The way you interpret the slogan is moot. Everyone doesn't think like you.
    You have completely confused the subject. It's not being banned and the ruling has nothing to do with the slogan being religious.

    The court ruled that NC could not offer one plate and reject the countering position.

    You can LIE all you want "choose life" is obviously a slogan of the pro life movement. Informed people know that it has nothing to do with alcohol.

    That does not mean it is forbidden but the state cannot promote one view while denying the opportunity to express the other.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    Offer a "pro-death" or "pro-choice" plate then...

    So what if the money goes to an organization that provides alternative solutions...

    It's not the "pro life" croweds fault that the pro-choice crowed didn't step up and petition for a "pro-choice" plate...
    They did. There were 6 attempts to amend the enabling act all defeated.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    Please cite the law created by the North Carolina legislature that prevents and punishes, by law, the issuing of pro-abortion statements. Such a law would assuredly be unconstitutional.
    Why the red herring?
    the ruling isn't about "statements."
    It's about the govt creating a venue for the expression of political ideas and then limiting the participation in that forum to only select citizenry.

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    People have a right to believe that killing the innocent is morally acceptable, and they have a right to tell others of their horrible beliefs so that people can judge them accordingly.
    Freedom is, in part, the freedom to be wrong and stupid.

    Quote Originally Posted by JayDubya View Post
    They don't necessarily have a right to have a license plate to help them proclaim their odious views. If the state puts one out, fine. If they don't, also fine. But there's nothing unconstitutional about putting one out OR NOT putting one out.
    If you read the blurb quoted in the OP, you may notice that this isn't the issue.
    The issue at hand is whether the govt can offer a public venue for political expression to only some political views instead of all political views.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Nick View Post
    It's not the pro-life crowed that wants the plates fault there is no alternative plate that says "pro-choice."

    It will be overturned.
    It won't. I doubt it will even get further hearing.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by BayToBay View Post
    It won't. I doubt it will even get further hearing.
    I am inclined to agree but afraid to bet that way.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: Judge finds NC "Choose Life" plate unconstitutioonal

    Quote Originally Posted by vendur View Post
    I find it interesting the sort of illogical dualism found in the idea of "you must present the opposing view". There is not a black and white divide on abortion, there are many shades of grey. Who determines the initial meaning, and who chooses what it considered its opposite? You could even argue the "kids first" logo was "pro-life" if you want to dive into the semantics, could you not? What of the intermediary views? People that support limited abortions? What would their logo be? And, again, we determines all this?

    What sort of absurdity is all this? Almost as absurd as the complete ignorance of the constitution by a judge who is nothing more than a leftwing hack and/or someone trying to score political points for some reason or other. Don't bother continuing to yammer about it being anything else.
    If some other view on abortion wants a plate they should get it.

    Those claiming the judge was wrong have shown nothing but ignorance on constitutional matters. They have even argued he should have created pro choice plates which is a power he clearly does not have.

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