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Thread: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    If it were to stop there you may have a somewhat reasonable argument, even though the 90s were a different time, and the economy was in better shape. But you forget the other end of that equation, at the same time Clinton raised the tax rates, he decimated the military budget, and together with repubs in the house, reformed welfare which Obama through his unelected minions is busy dismantling for the future welfare state.
    None of that answers the question that you led with: how does raising tax rates to Clinton levels on the rich damage the republican party?

    I notice the writer of that statement has FAILED to answer it as well.
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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    None of that answers the question that you led with: how does raising tax rates to Clinton levels on the rich damage the republican party?

    I notice the writer of that statement has FAILED to answer it as well.
    No you're right. It was about your utterly misleading, and foolish statement praising the Clinton era tax rates....Also, what it does do to answer your question is to expose the things in the 90s that were different when compared to today, so your meme, is false from the start.
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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    No you're right. It was about your utterly misleading, and foolish statement praising the Clinton era tax rates....Also, what it does do to answer your question is to expose the things in the 90s that were different when compared to today, so your meme, is false from the start.
    Perhaps you would be good enough to quote my statement "praising the Clinton era tax rates"? All I did was ask American an question based on his allegation

    How does raising tax rates to Clinton levels on the rich damage the Republican Party?
    I am sure you are intelligent and old enough to realize that no time is exactly like another time. Every year is different. So to pretend that now is somehow unique compared to eras of previous history and that amazing revelation wins the day for you is simply silly.

    I join you in accepting that today is different than the 90's. Today we have a 16 trillion dollar debt that needs to be paid so our kids and my grandchildren do not have to pay it. And that needs to start today.
    Last edited by haymarket; 12-08-12 at 04:53 PM.
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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Perhaps you would be good enough to quote my statement "praising the Clinton era tax rates"? All I did was ask American an question based on his allegation

    Ok, maybe I assumed prematurely, So you're saying that you don't think that raising taxes would hurt Repubs? Tell me why you think that?

    I join you in accepting that today is different than the 90's. Today we have a 16 trillion dollar debt that needs to be paid so our kids and my grandchildren do not have to pay it. And that needs to start today.
    Good, now all we need is to agree on how to do that....What is your suggestion?
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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Ok, maybe I assumed prematurely, So you're saying that you don't think that raising taxes would hurt Repubs? Tell me why you think that?



    Good, now all we need is to agree on how to do that....What is your suggestion?
    What I said was clear and unmistakable as I have now reprinted it several times in response to a claim made by American right here in this thread:

    How does raising tax rates to Clinton levels on the rich damage the Republican Party?
    Are we clear on this?
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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Ok, maybe I assumed prematurely, So you're saying that you don't think that raising taxes would hurt Repubs? Tell me why you think that?



    Good, now all we need is to agree on how to do that....What is your suggestion?
    I have long advocated that tax rates on ALL Americans earning dollar one go up by five points across the board. Further, the special rates for both capital gains and estate taxes should be abolished and both simply treated as income according to the regular schedules. FICA should be paid on 100% of income by 100% of earners not simply the 93% who pay on 100% of income today.

    As for spending I would cut it by at least $400 billion this year.
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    What I said was clear and unmistakable as I have now reprinted it several times in response to a claim made by American right here in this thread:



    Are we clear on this?
    DBAJ....But I'll let it go.

    I have long advocated that tax rates on ALL Americans earning dollar one go up by five points across the board. Further, the special rates for both capital gains and estate taxes should be abolished and both simply treated as income according to the regular schedules. FICA should be paid on 100% of income by 100% of earners not simply the 93% who pay on 100% of income today.
    So you are advocating a wealth tax on top of income taxes? Good luck with that one....FICA, is interesting though, I have also questioned why there is a cap on earnings for that tax.

    As for spending I would cut it by at least $400 billion this year.
    can you be specific?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    its interesting that the welfare socialists are not calling for spending cuts

    they merely don't like the rich or more likely, their own failure to be rich despite thinking they are smarter and more worthy than the rich, and merely want to punish people who have the wealth these welfare socialists think they themselves should have

    its governmental vandalism that motivates them-if they cannot have something they don't want others to have it.

    this crap about deficit reduction is just that. you all don't want deficit reduction because you want more and more government spending to justify economic vandalism imposed on those more prosperous than you are
    What they want to do is tax the successful, those who went for the American Dream and achieved it.

    They must know, they have been told often enough, that 'taxing the rich' will do nothing to solve the debt problem or any budgetary problems. It is a drop in that hole filled bucket.

    It is a jealousy tax, a green-eyed tax, a tax on those who have achieved something in their lives against those who don't have a clue about how wealth is either created or managed.

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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    DBAJ....But I'll let it go.



    So you are advocating a wealth tax on top of income taxes? Good luck with that one....FICA, is interesting though, I have also questioned why there is a cap on earnings for that tax.



    can you be specific?
    Where did I mention a special wealth tax?

    On cuts - mostly from the military budget. And of course cutting down on the debt will save in paying interest revenues as well from year to year in the future so there is a cut there as well.
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Where did I mention a special wealth tax?

    On cuts - mostly from the military budget. And of course cutting down on the debt will save in paying interest revenues as well from year to year in the future so there is a cut there as well.

    So then what is different from going off the cliff then?
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

    Alexis de Tocqueville

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