Page 36 of 76 FirstFirst ... 26343536373846 ... LastLast
Results 351 to 360 of 758

Thread: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

  1. #351
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:30 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,077

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    once again, i tend to doubt that treating investment income as income above a cap is going to make most people stop investing in the long term.
    I agree. What I also think (and what you did not address) is that people invest to maximize return while minimizing risk, US business is not the only place to invest. Lower the return while keeping risk a constant (or rather, actually, mildly increasing it), and you make other investment venues more competitive relative to US Business. Canada (whose corporate tax rate is now 15%), for example, will do rather well off of a decision by us to hike up the capital gains rate.

    i would also argue that one tax that is ripe for lowering is the corporate tax. we're much better off taxing individuals while having a very competitive corporate rate. we're kind of doing the opposite right now, and i think that we should make some changes.
    On this we would agree. Sadly, though he has mentioned it several times, the President seems to have no desire whatsoever to do so, and I imagine would infuriate a significant section of his base if he tried to.

    stupid would be going over the cliff and enacting these cuts and rate hikes all at once.
    We tried to spend our way into prosperity and, once that didn't get us there, tried to borrow and spend our way into prosperity. We are in for some pain. Let's get it over with.

    we could probably tier it, but i doubt that the cap for no tax could be set at $200k. someone who has done the math on such a proposed system would have to weigh in, though.
    Looking at.... static losses?

    the compromise put forward by them includes no rate hikes and depends on unspecified loopholes to fill the gap. which loopholes?
    Oh. So in fact they do not do this, but you are imagining that they might.

    To answer your follow on question - the proposals that the Republicans have put forward include limiting the total size of deductions, getting rid of the state tax deduction, limiting the mortgage interest deduction to a primary residence below a lower worth cap, and a few others. Their plan is explicitly modeled after the Presidents OWN Simpson Bowles Commissions' model, which got rid of the vast majority of deductions and loopholes.

    Likewise, Obama's plan puts it all on the wealthy to solve the problem. both plans are nonstarters, and are designed to be goalposts.
    That is not true, as the GOP plan starts from the Simpson-Bowles position, but (and this is important) without the significant nominal rate reductions.

    improperly phased in. that should be a lesson to us.
    Improperly phased in?

    i'm ok with means testing and perhaps raising the contribution ceiling, but cutting the wealthy completely out of the system isn't something i support. if they paid in, they should be able to collect.
    Well, that was the Ryan Argument as well - to means test and then simply reduce payouts to higher net worth individuals in order to protect lower net worth individuals. Frankly I think that reality is a bit starker than that. The alternative to drastic reductions in our entitlement expenditure is to at some point not too far in the future (think, within the next 15 years) that we cease having an entitlement structure. Then we really are going to face the choice of kicking grandma out in the cold. If cuts in spending have to be made, let them be made first on those who do not require these services.

    i doubt that we're at the far right of the Laffer curve, and i haven't read too many unbiased economists arguing that we were.
    there is no such thing as an unbiased economist for the simple enough reason that there is no such thing as an unbiased human being. That being said, you will note that the economist I cited was Christina Romer, who is not exactly a noted Grover Norquist type.

    raising rates will increase revenue, but it has to be done carefully, as do the spending cuts. we definitely need growth, but going over the cliff risks killing both supply and demand sides for years to come. growth is screwed if we go over the cliff.
    I see no historical evidence to suppose that raising rates will increase revenue; especially given that revenue is tied to growth, and that over the past 4-5 decades rate hikes have been recessionary. Growth is screwed if we hike rates. It is not screwed if we slash spending, unless we do it in such a way as to destroy the security guarantee that the US Navy provides to global trade.

  2. #352
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Britain’s Missing Millionaires | Casino Capitalism and Crapshoot Politics

    It's the same reason why Californians are moving to Texas and why England lost many of their rock stars to the US during "The British Invasion", or even why people died attempting to escape communist countries.

    Examples of this futile exercise of "taxing the rich" to solve a nation's spending problems abound. That people still believe it is possible to solve excessive government spending by taxing a small segment of society is difficult to explain when the evidence to the contrary remains so very clear.

  3. #353
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    WASHINGTON (AP) — "Americans prefer letting tax cuts expire for the country's top earners, as President Barack Obama insists, while support has declined for cutting government services to curb budget deficits, an Associated Press-GfK poll shows. Fewer than half the Republicans polled favor continuing the Bush-era tax cuts for the wealthy.

    There's also a reluctance to trim Social Security, Medicare or defense programs, three of the biggest drivers of federal spending, the survey released Wednesday found. The results could strengthen Obama's hand in his fiscal cliff duel with Republicans, in which he wants to raise taxes on the rich and cut spending by less than the GOP wants."

    Poll shows support for raising taxes on the rich - Yahoo! News

    This puts House Republicans running for reelection in 2014 in a very bad position, and an opportunity for Democrats to take the House if Republicans don't extend the middle class tax cuts before they expire.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  4. #354
    Sage
    minnie616's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:50 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    14,941

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    The only purpose for raising tax rates is to damage the Republican Party. There IS no other reason. ....
    Why will letting the Bush tax cuts expire on the top 2 percent earners damage the Republican Party?

    There is another reason.
    When more of the middle class has more spending money they buy more/better housing and more goods and services which helps businesses grow. When businesses grow they hire more people who will spend more and help grow the economy.

    That is a win/win situation for our nation.
    When it comes to matters of reproduce health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

  5. #355
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Chicago Illinois
    Last Seen
    10-14-15 @ 09:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Private
    Posts
    56,981

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by 274ina View Post
    With Obamas figures, a small amount to help nearly balance the budget. And still they refuse to pay this
    TINY amount.

    They need to be taxed 80% untill debt is $2B.
    Course Obama actually having Correct figures for a Change might help.....huh?

  6. #356
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Chicago Illinois
    Last Seen
    10-14-15 @ 09:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Private
    Posts
    56,981

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by TaraAnne View Post
    This would prove what exactly? Nothing other than making the Republicans more of a laughing stock than they already are. Obama still hasnt taken more time off than Bush 1 and two combined. Need we mentioned the disaster the Republicans made out of Katrina. Please I hope this happens because SNL will get funny again! I think this is one of the main reason Republicans lost this last election political madness that somehow some way Obama is taking something, hiding something. A strong majority in this country does not buy into the Republican mantra of: we are the party of fiscal responcibility, or morals. Please tell me how they are the last three republican presidents and congress are to blame for the huge debt we are in now. Yes Obama owns alot of things but not the 80% of the debt that was racked up under the Republicans watch. Yes there is a way to pay down the debt. However, both parties do not want to do it. I think the cuts should start at 20% cut in military and the tax rates go back up to Reagan levels.


    Republicans and Democrats have sharply different reactions to the government's taking such an active role in equalizing economic outcomes. Seven in 10 Democrats believe the government should levy taxes on the rich to redistribute wealth, while an equal proportion of Republicans believe it should not. The slight majority of independents oppose this policy.

    Bottom Line

    While a solid majority of Americans, 57%, believe money and wealth in the U.S. should be more evenly distributed among the people, fewer than half favor using the federal tax code to do so. The fault line in these views is distinctly partisan, with most Democrats championing redistribution and most Republicans opposing it......snip~

    Americans Divided on Taxing the Rich to Redistribute Wealth


    U were Allegedly saying something about some sort of Strong majority.....huh? What do you think happens when ya takes the Majority of Independents and put them in with a Ranking that is nearly tied in statistics? So much on the fallacy of the hyped up so called majority!

    Seems the majority of Americans don't favor using the Federal tax Code to do so......seems that's where some of the confusion comes in. Or that Progressives refuse to acknowledge that fact while saying 60% percent say go ahead and tax the Rich. Do you think that such is due to their ability to not ready all the words when reports comes out. Or do they just deliberately forget?

  7. #357
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 03:45 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,262

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by TaraAnne View Post
    This would prove what exactly? Nothing other than making the Republicans more of a laughing stock than they already are. Obama still hasnt taken more time off than Bush 1 and two combined. Need we mentioned the disaster the Republicans made out of Katrina. Please I hope this happens because SNL will get funny again! I think this is one of the main reason Republicans lost this last election political madness that somehow some way Obama is taking something, hiding something. A strong majority in this country does not buy into the Republican mantra of: we are the party of fiscal responcibility, or morals. Please tell me how they are the last three republican presidents and congress are to blame for the huge debt we are in now. Yes Obama owns alot of things but not the 80% of the debt that was racked up under the Republicans watch. Yes there is a way to pay down the debt. However, both parties do not want to do it. I think the cuts should start at 20% cut in military and the tax rates go back up to Reagan levels.
    Democratic Party thinks they're the winners, so using their tactics should make them proud.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  8. #358
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 03:45 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,262

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    Why will letting the Bush tax cuts expire on the top 2 percent earners damage the Republican Party?

    There is another reason.
    When more of the middle class has more spending money they buy more/better housing and more goods and services which helps businesses grow. When businesses grow they hire more people who will spend more and help grow the economy.

    That is a win/win situation for our nation.
    Because they don't believe in raising taxes.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  9. #359
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Chicago Illinois
    Last Seen
    10-14-15 @ 09:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Private
    Posts
    56,981

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    Why will letting the Bush tax cuts expire on the top 2 percent earners damage the Republican Party?

    There is another reason.
    When more of the middle class has more spending money they buy more/better housing and more goods and services which helps businesses grow. When businesses grow they hire more people who will spend more and help grow the economy.

    That is a win/win situation for our nation.
    Hows that work when they have less money to spend? Again all those under 250k will be paying the price.....which we did show ya some of why remember?

    By ruling that ObamaCare is constitutional, the Supreme Court has set in motion a slew of tax hikes. Well, someone has to pay for it. For rich folks, looming big is the 3.8% Medicare surtax on investment income, and the 0.9% Medicare payroll tax hike (from 1.45% to 2.35%). And then there are the tax hikes for everybody else.

    Obama’s pledge against any form of tax increase on Americans making less than $250,000 a year “was thrown out the window” when he signed the healthcare law, says John Kartch, communications director with Americans For Tax Reform (founded by anti-tax crusader Grover Norquist).


    No. 1. The Individual Mandate Excise Tax. Starting in 2014, anyone not buying “qualifying” health insurance must pay an income tax surtax. It goes up each year until 2016 and beyond when a couple would pay a tax of the higher of $1,360 or 2.5% of adjusted gross income.

    No. 2. The Over-The-Counter Drugs Trap. Since Jan. 1, 2011, employees with health savings accounts, flexible spending accounts or health reimbursement accounts have no longer been able to use pre-tax funds stashed in these accounts to buy over-the-counter medicines for allergy relief and the like without a doctor’s prescription (there’s an exception for insulin).

    No. 3. The Healthcare Flexible Spending Account Cap. Starting Jan. 1, 2013, employees will face a $2,500 cap on the amount of pre-tax salary deferrals they can make into a healthcare flexible spending account. There is no cap under current law. In light of the new cap, employee benefits groups are lobbying for Congress to modify the use-it-or-lose-it rule that means employees forfeit unused funds in their accounts at the end of the plan year.

    No. 4. The Medical Itemized Deduction Hurdle. Starting Jan. 1, 2013, taxpayers who face high medical expenses will only be allowed a deduction for expenses to the extent they exceed 10% of adjusted gross income, up from 7.5% now. Taxpayers 65 and older can still use the old 7.5% threshold through 2016. For how to score the medical expense deduction before 2013, click here.

    No. 5. The Health Savings Account Withdrawal Penalty. Since Jan. 1, 2011, taxpayers who withdraw money from health savings accounts for non-medical expenses before age 65 face a 20% penalty, up from 10% before.

    No. 6. The Indoor Tanning Services Tax. Since July 1, 2010, folks using indoor tanning salons face a new 10% excise tax. This one hasn’t been bringing in as much revenue as anticipated.

    No. 7. The Cadillac Health Insurance Plan Tax. Starting in 2018, there will be a new 40% excise tax on taxpayers who are covered by high-cost health insurance plans (with premiums at or above $10,200 for a single or $27,500 for a family). Insurers or employers who are self-insured will pay the tax, but it is expected to trickle down to mean higher costs for consumers.

    Americans For Tax Reform has a full list of ObamaCare’s 20 new or higher taxes on American families and small businesses.....snip~

    ObamaCare's 7 Tax Hikes On Under $250,000-A-Year Earners - Forbes


    Did ya want to look at the 20 others?

  10. #360
    Sage
    Fletch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Mentor Ohio
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:46 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    15,267

    Re: No Fiscal Deal Without Higher Tax Rates On Rich, Obama Says

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    WASHINGTON (AP) — "Americans prefer letting tax cuts expire for the country's top earners, as President Barack Obama insists, while support has declined for cutting government services to curb budget deficits, an Associated Press-GfK poll shows. Fewer than half the Republicans polled favor continuing the Bush-era tax cuts for the wealthy.

    There's also a reluctance to trim Social Security, Medicare or defense programs, three of the biggest drivers of federal spending, the survey released Wednesday found. The results could strengthen Obama's hand in his fiscal cliff duel with Republicans, in which he wants to raise taxes on the rich and cut spending by less than the GOP wants."

    Poll shows support for raising taxes on the rich - Yahoo! News

    This puts House Republicans running for reelection in 2014 in a very bad position, and an opportunity for Democrats to take the House if Republicans don't extend the middle class tax cuts before they expire.
    In other words, polls show people want handouts to continue and want someone else to pay for them. Is that really a surprise?

Page 36 of 76 FirstFirst ... 26343536373846 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •