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Thread: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    Just its very presence (FIT) is and has been argued since 1913. It has many exemptions and penalties. Nobody likes it very much.

    See the similarities?

    We're just going to have to wait and see how it (Obamacare) sorts itself out. If it's as hideous as you might imagine, then someone else will be elected. Apparently, for now, a majority has accepted it.
    There is a distinct difference between an unpopular law and one that violates one (or more) Constitutional principles. The FIT law required a Constitutional amendment and, as you say, has morphed into an 80K+ page mess. A temporary majority of demorats in congress cobbled PPACA together and passed it in 2009 over the objections of every republicant, it was altered (slightly) by the SCOTUS even before its scheduled "full" implementation date in 2014. It is not popular, in whole, but has a few supporters that appear to believe in the tooth fairy and the sales pitches made for it. Like that country song goes "you're not the best, but you're the best that I can do". Yes he did!
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    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    I think you misunderstood my point. I'm just saying that most laws ARE enforced even though they are unpopular and not many are unenforced or ignored.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    So when a federal law gets old it no longer needs enforced, but when its new it has to be enforced? I don't think it works that way.

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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    I seem to recall something like that as well...but see this is how authoritarian progressives get what they want whether you like it or not..When you find their loophole, as in the exchanges, they smack you with a heavy handed regulation, if that doesn't work because the court says no, then ignore the court. Welcome to the United State of Chicago.
    And I remember the Bush administration telling me I have to watch what I say. Here's the deal, whoever gets into power abuses power. Bush did it then, and Obama is doing it now. How do we stop this continual abuse of power? Third party, bud. Until enough people realize this, we are going to continue getting screwed, no matter who is in office. And I walk what I talk. I voted Gary Johnson.
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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    I view PPACA as the beginning of the end for private medical care insurance. Insurance is for the rare, unexpected and expensive events in life, not routine maintanence and normal day to day expenses. Imagine your auto insurance premium cost if the gov't mandated that it cover "free" annual tune-ups, oil changes and worn tire replacement.

    Insurance is also intended to be actuarially based, the higher the risk the higher the premium. PPACA mandates ignoring all health risk factors except smoking and age, making those that are obese suddenly seem "normal". That is like mandating that auto insurance ignore all driving records and vehicle costs, or homeowners insurance ignore the purchase price of the dwelling and its condidtion.
    You entirely miss that the point of the AHC act is to get everyone insured. Everyone gets sick and everyone needs to have healthcare insured or not. Acutarial tables do not insure people they deny insurance to those that need it most. That is the opposite of what we need. Why waste million of dollars with elaborate claims denial operations when those people will most likely get treated anyway by Medicaid or othe rGovt. programs? It is just moving the costs around and doesn't really save on health care costs at all

    The fact that this is acomplished quite well in other western nations has also gone right over your head. Why is the United Sates so medically challenged that we can't care for our people? I think we can and will.

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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    You entirely miss that the point of the AHC act is to get everyone insured. Everyone gets sick and everyone needs to have healthcare insured or not. Acutarial tables do not insure people they deny insurance to those that need it most. That is the opposite of what we need. Why waste million of dollars with elaborate claims denial operations when those people will most likely get treated anyway by Medicaid or othe rGovt. programs? It is just moving the costs around and doesn't really save on health care costs at all

    The fact that this is acomplished quite well in other western nations has also gone right over your head. Why is the United Sates so medically challenged that we can't care for our people? I think we can and will.
    Name one other western nation with this Rube Goldberg mess for their medical care system. It does not take over 2400 pages of law to mandate that all must have private medical care insurance and that those companies must take all commers and to establish a premium rate cap. Do you also advocate that the gov't make a driver with no tickets pay the same rate as one with 3 DWI's? That insurance for a shack cost the same as for a mansion?

    PPACA adds to premium costs, since it encourages more medical care insurance claims, mandates certain services have no deductable or co-pay and limits the factors that may be considered to establish premium rates. Beyond those added premium costs come direct gov't subsidies to pay the premiums of the working poor, which has been seriously low-balled to/by the CBO - that budget reality will soon appear, just as Obama leaves office. Yes he did!
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 12-03-12 at 08:19 AM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    And I remember the Bush administration telling me I have to watch what I say. Here's the deal, whoever gets into power abuses power. Bush did it then, and Obama is doing it now. How do we stop this continual abuse of power? Third party, bud. Until enough people realize this, we are going to continue getting screwed, no matter who is in office. And I walk what I talk. I voted Gary Johnson.

    So you don't think that some other party in power would abuse power? Absolute power corrupts absolutely. We could have 27 parties and the person in charge would be subject to abusing the power of the office. You voted Gary Johnson, well rudy poo for you. Had you and your band of merry contrarian dope advocates had realized the importance of this election and voted rationally to remove this dictator wanna be, we wouldn't be rushing head long into the demise we are pressing the gas pedal to the floor to get to. Thanks for that.
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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Well, until they go through the proper channels to get approval, they should comply.
    The proper channel is known as “The Tenth Amendment”.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Nonsense. You have given no examples of other "modern" legislation that does any of the three things that I mentioned, related to the PPACA law. Medicaid comes close, but that at least has federal matching funding, unlike the subject of this post - a federal law attempting to "punish" a state for exercising an "option". Remember that the SCOTUS ruled that "punishing" states for not implementing the state exchanges "option", by withholding that state's Medicaid funds, was unconstitutional. Obama seems to think that passing this "punishment" (3.5% premium fee) down to the state's insurance carriers, who will simply pass it on to that state's residents, is a slick end run around that SCOTUS ruling. Yes he did!
    ^^^^^ This is exactly what it is about. You called this out Correctly T7.....moreover all you stated afterwards was excellent on the Obama Play. Again I just wanted to point out that Crystal Clear Point for those on the left to see. Which is the Insurance Carriers will pass the cost all along to that States's Residents.

    This means the The Non Definable middle class and the Poor. Higher Costs, more visits to a doctor, and all the Spending that comes with it. The Progressives duped the rest on the Left. Course then they deflect and talk about Prescriptions Drugs to perk the Ears of the Seniors.

    Thanks as I was trying to get that point out with the SCOTUS and the End Run by Obama!

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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    Just its very presence (FIT) is and has been argued since 1913. It has many exemptions and penalties. Nobody likes it very much.

    See the similarities?

    We're just going to have to wait and see how it (Obamacare) sorts itself out. If it's as hideous as you might imagine, then someone else will be elected. Apparently, for now, a majority has accepted it.
    That would be incorrect. The majority hasn't accept it, which is why Obama is willing to cave with some issues within his own Plan that he never knew about until last year. Which is why.....no one is listening to the DNC pumping up the Jams as to "hey" we won. Everybody is suppose to roll over because they won. I hope that part of the Delusion wears off soon and the Democrats realize they aint getting NOTHING else for FREE!

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    Re: Obama Slaps States That Don't Comply With Obamacare

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So you don't think that some other party in power would abuse power? Absolute power corrupts absolutely. We could have 27 parties and the person in charge would be subject to abusing the power of the office. You voted Gary Johnson, well rudy poo for you. Had you and your band of merry contrarian dope advocates had realized the importance of this election and voted rationally to remove this dictator wanna be, we wouldn't be rushing head long into the demise we are pressing the gas pedal to the floor to get to. Thanks for that.

    U got that Right J-Mac.....they knew Johnson stood no chance. Although he was the Bigger draw out of those Libertarian Parties. They should have set up their Saints going Marching in tune for 2016 and Jumped out the Box planning for then. Instead they gave the Country up to Obama and the Demos.

    To me it was the basic fact that they cannot recognize the Progressives Agenda and what that is all about. Thinking they are tied to the T. Roosevelt Progressives. Which have nothing to do with the Progressive movement. Moreover Johnson got to see the Movie On Obama before it was released. He should have though of Country First. Not Party. Now Obama is the Lame duck. But he will have to be fought all the way on anything and everything.

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