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Thread: Education

  1. #51
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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by JRog View Post
    Go ahead and do it all day. I think you'd find the poorest performing schools are those which reside in city areas with poverty. Hard to expect good performance from school children when they have unstable home lives as both parents are working and they're still barely scraping by enough to pay for food or healthcare. Poverty = higher crime and lower education. What do the countries ahead of us have significantly in common? STRONG SOCIAL PROGRAMS including EDUCATION SPENDING.
    That's not the point. The point is that these students don't need advanced mathematics. Let's not lose sight of what we were discussing.

    Honestly, it's comical that a political ideology attempts to pull away social spending and education spending, villanizes education as "elitist", and then complains about how poor our schools are
    I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. You find very strange things comical. Our schools are failing generations of children. And yet we just keep doing the same thing over and over and over again. And we know what the defines, don't we?

    BTW, it isn't all about poverty. Naperville, listed above, has a median household income of over $100,000 per year.
    Last edited by MaggieD; 11-27-12 at 12:42 PM.
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  2. #52
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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    It's not education funding. The United States average is 20% higher than Finland. Education Matters: So, how DID Finland do it?
    Well if that is the case why wont USA hire more qualitative instructors from abroad?

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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    That's not the point. The point is that these students don't need advanced mathematics. Let's not lose sight of what we were discussing.
    If you want to be specific, the original discussion was about why we bother teaching students subjects they "won't need". It was not originally a discussion about poor performing students, just the ones who we (no idea which governmental board would determine who gets to learn math and who doesn't) magically determine won't eventually need it.

    Let me give you an anecdotal story, my brother had behavioural problems in middle school and high school. He had some learning disabilities as well. When he became a junior and senior in high school, he became much more focused and ended up with a master's degree in engineering working in the development of tools for the DoD. Sure glad they didn't determine that he wouldn't "need" advanced math.

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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by JRog View Post
    Unfortunately, the performance of students is brought down by funding and lack of focus on education. How can our education system thrive when a large portion of the political ideology of our country celebrates ignorance?
    There is plenty of funding.... when we stop using that money for Art, Music, Gym, Sports, etc.... for everyone instead of using those things as the carrot to ensure that students are keeping up with their basic skills at or above grade level. You are right that there's a lack of focus on education. The focus is simply on an assembly-line ideal where the kids are moved along whether they can actually do the work or not. We need to be willing to say to a parent... "Sorry, Mrs. Smith but Johnny has to stay in 4th grade AGAIN, because even the second time through he still isn't meeting the requirements to move on."

    It's not that we celebrate "ignorance" JRog. It's that we simply don't have any use for political indoctrination of our children by individuals who are not directly answerable to US.

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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    Are you telling me that at the 7th and 8th grade levels you didn't have a pretty good idea which of your classmates were college material and which were likely to be working the Slurpee machine at Seven-11?
    No, I don't. And it's not a belief, it's a science called developmental psychology.

    If you need a calculator to add 154+225, you've got a major problem. The ceiling has gone up but the floor still remains where it has always been. The problem is that instead of a ladder or stairs we put these kids on an escalator so they reach the top whether they're actually capable of getting there on their own or not.
    Math is actually taught in a different fashion in schools now. No more memorizing multiplication and division tables. They're now learning math theory as early as kindergarten. I guess we'll see if that helps. But the inability to do mental math doesn't indicate a major inability to do math. One can understand math theory without being able to look at numbers and add them together.

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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Spriggs05 View Post
    BBC News - UK education sixth in global ranking

    EDUCATION TOP 20
    Finland
    South Korea
    Hong Kong
    Japan
    Singapore
    UK
    Netherlands
    New Zealand
    Switzerland
    Canada
    Ireland
    Denmark
    Australia
    Poland
    Germany
    Belgium
    USA
    Hungary
    Slovakia
    Russia
    The thing that is really surprising is that the US even ranks that high.

    MaggieD pointed out the track system, but even that is not the full story.

    While the track system would help in the US, it is not a total solution. Culture, or the lack thereof, is the greatest factor affecting the US. We in the US face challenges that many of those other countries don't have, and where they do, they approach it differently. While they do have a very small minority, the better performing nations are all Mono-Culture, Mono-Ethnic in make up. I notice that France is completely missing from the list, the only other country that has tried a Multi-Cultural approach. We actually spend money and time on Multi-Cultural education and other liberal nonsense.

    Blacks and Hispanics in this country have a culture of poverty and in those areas, our schools are the worse in the nation. Some have tried breaking out of that culture, but by no means enough of them. This will continue until these "Cultures" choose to break that cycle. When they finally decide to place the future of their children above loyalty to their race/culture and help instead of hinder police from cleaning up the gangers, violence and educate their children breaking the repeated cycles of welfarism, teen pregnancy, poor discipline, etc, integrating themselves into a mono-cultural society, only then will our education system truly improve, not to mention many other areas that are failing in America today.
    Only a fool measures equality by results and not opportunities.

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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    Are you telling me that at the 7th and 8th grade levels you didn't have a pretty good idea which of your classmates were college material and which were likely to be working the Slurpee machine at Seven-11?

    If you need a calculator to add 154+225, you've got a major problem. The ceiling has gone up but the floor still remains where it has always been. The problem is that instead of a ladder or stairs we put these kids on an escalator so they reach the top whether they're actually capable of getting there on their own or not.
    hell, before they leave elementary school, the teachers can even identify which students will reside in our correctional system
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger View Post
    There is plenty of funding.... when we stop using that money for Art, Music, Gym, Sports, etc.... for everyone instead of using those things as the carrot to ensure that students are keeping up with their basic skills at or above grade level. You are right that there's a lack of focus on education. The focus is simply on an assembly-line ideal where the kids are moved along whether they can actually do the work or not. We need to be willing to say to a parent... "Sorry, Mrs. Smith but Johnny has to stay in 4th grade AGAIN, because even the second time through he still isn't meeting the requirements to move on."
    Studies have shown that students that participate in music and art learn better. How many students who participate in the school plays or the orchestra do you know that ended up working at 7-11? The students who end up with those jobs usually only participate the minimum. Athletics builds team skills, which are important in almost every field of work. A well-rounded education is important, even if you don't think that music, art and athletics are important.

    It's not that we celebrate "ignorance" JRog. It's that we simply don't have any use for political indoctrination of our children by individuals who are not directly answerable to US.
    Learning about math and science is not political indoctrination. It just so happens that one political party generally disagrees with math and science based on their religious beliefs.

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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by JRog View Post
    It just so happens that one political party generally disagrees with math and science based on their religious beliefs.
    Holy Moly. Where did that come from?
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Education

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Holy Moly. Where did that come from?
    It came from this.

    It's not that we celebrate "ignorance" JRog. It's that we simply don't have any use for political indoctrination of our children by individuals who are not directly answerable to US.
    I hear this argument all the time from religious zealots and anti-science individuals.

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