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Thread: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

  1. #111
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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by a351 View Post
    What led you to this conclusion?
    You didn't get the point?
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

  2. #112
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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    some of it was pretty much illegal

    and all of it would get your average citizen thrown in jail.
    Gleeming over the rehashed arguments, and right to the meat of the post. Pretty much illegal according to a casual bystander's point of view? Doesn't cut it. Just orphan that original argument about the merits of granting every Tom Dick and Harry the ability to sue the living you know what out of any congressman with whom they have a personal grievance, and all of this silliness will just disappear.

    Average citizens are just that. Private citizens aren't granted the same allowances for good reason, nor are they in a position to craft national laws. There's your difference. Apples and Orangutans. No need to even pursue that analogy.
    Last edited by a351; 11-21-12 at 09:22 PM.

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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by a351 View Post
    Gleeming over the rehashed arguments, and right to the meat of the post. Pretty much illegal from a bystander's point of view? Doesn't cut it. Just orphan that original argument about the lawsuit and all of this silliness will just disappear.

    Average citizens are just that. Private citizens aren't granted the same allowances for good reason, nor are they in a position to craft national laws. There's your difference. Apples and Orangutans. No need to even pursue that analogy.
    And here is where the problem lies. People are willing to excuse politicians being protected from things that citizens, i.e. their employers would have to answer for. "The ends justify the means" right?
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    You didn't get the point?
    Just wondering from what source you derived the idea that individualism as a whole will simply be cast out the window because of seemingly unstated text regarding health reform.

  5. #115
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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by a351 View Post
    Just wondering from what source you derived the idea that individualism as a whole will simply be cast out the window because of seemingly unstated text regarding health reform.
    I see you didn't get the point. At some point you have to draw the line.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    And here is where the problem lies. People are willing to excuse politicians being protected from things that citizens, i.e. their employers would have to answer for. "The ends justify the means" right?
    The relationship between Employers and employees, and Representatives and constituents is not analogous in the least. Past the surface of the claim, I'm sure you would agree as well. After all, employers who choose not to contribute to their employers health care costs are in your words "screwing them over" in regards to their personal finances. Should an employee be able to sue said employer? Should I be able to levy a lawsuit against an employer who reduces my hours? Cuts my wages? If we're being honest here, comparing employers and legislative representatives is indeed a fool's errand even when using your standards.

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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by a351 View Post
    The relationship between Employers and employees, and Representatives and constituents is not analogous in the least. Past the surface of the claim, I'm sure you would agree as well. After all, employers who choose not to contribute to their employers health care costs are in your words "screwing them over" in regards to their personal finances. Should an employee be able to sue said employer? Should I be able to levy a lawsuit against an employer who reduces my hours? Cuts my wages? If we're being honest here, comparing employers and legislative representatives is indeed a fool's errand even when using your standards.
    You're right, I can't use bribery to do business. I cannot take other people's money through taxation, then give it to a senator to do what I want them to do. When I was in the insurance business I had to go through compliance departments before giving anything more than marketing based office supplies as gifts because..............it could be inducement. I can't threaten people with a fund cutoff to get them to change their minds, that's coercion, and I couldn't falsify anything when selling a product, that would be fraud. I could not have anything in a policy change without notice, so you're right, our employees(representatives) are not being held to the ethical standards they IMPOSE by law on others. Thank you for making my point.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  8. #118
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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Yes, like how earthquake codes mean we have "one size fits all buildings."
    You think this is all good while people are losing their insurance coverage. People like you don't care about health insurance or whether people are getting care.....all that matters is that a liberal government policy is in place.

    Then you can go brag on forums about how your side won.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  9. #119
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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    You're right, I can't use bribery to do business.

    I cannot take other people's money through taxation, then give it to a senator to do what I want them to do.

    When I was in the insurance business I had to go through compliance departments before giving anything more than marketing based office supplies as gifts because..............it could be inducement.

    I can't threaten people with a fund cutoff to get them to change their minds, that's coercion

    , and I couldn't falsify anything when selling a product, that would be fraud.

    I could not have anything in a policy change without notice.
    Well, you could in a roundabout way. Bribery is a crime that's not terribly easy to prosecute. Lot's of subjectivity at play.

    That's a given, unless you're a tax collecting authority by night.

    Ok? There are routine probes into the misuse of campaign financing and the uses therein. John Edwards?

    Actually, as you know, Insurance companies did have quite a nasty history of dropping coverage or completely defunding individuals who simply got too ill for their tastes, and it was quite legal until now.

    Yes, if you knowingly put forth misinformation within a legal document, or default on a legal agreement you may be prosecuted. Same goes for our representatives I'm afraid.

    Legislative policy changes are published daily and available to the general public. Secrecy if you don't keep track of them I guess.
    Last edited by a351; 11-21-12 at 10:04 PM.

  10. #120
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    Re: Federal government releases long-awaited health reform rules

    Quote Originally Posted by a351 View Post
    Well, you could in a roundabout way. Bribery is a crime that's not terribly easy to prosecute. Lot's of subjectivity at play.

    That's a given, unless you're a tax collecting authority by night.

    Ok? There are routine probes into the misuse of campaign financing and the uses therein. John Edwards?

    Actually, as you know, Insurance companies did have quite a nasty history of dropping coverage or defunding completely individuals who simply got too ill for their tastes, and it was quite legal until now.

    Yes, if you knowingly put forth misinformation within a legal document, or default on a legal agreement you may be prosecuted. Same goes for our representatives I'm afraid.

    Legislative policy changes are published daily and available to the general public. Secrecy if you don't keep track of them.
    Okay, but political bribery like the "Cornhusker kickback" and the "Louisiana purchase" are exactly the same thing as if I were to induce a big client into signing up for the products I offered except for two differences. 1) The political inducements were right out in the open and 2) I would have gone to prison.

    So, how do you reconcile the fact that I could have screwed maybe 5 competitors out of a shot at money versus ****ing over an entire country using the exact same tactic? How do you reconcile that it's illegal for private citizens but standard protocol for politicians?
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

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