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Thread: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

  1. #51
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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by Oozlefinch View Post
    I honestly believe that they never negotiated in good faith. They smelled blood on the water, and thought they could milk the company for every cent they could. However, the underestimated how bad the financial trouble was.
    This could be the case. Could be their negotiating team mishandled themselves and got things painted into a corner. *shrug* Would not be the first. Maybe there was a screw-up between management negotiation team and the Bakerís team with dick-moves from around the table, that is pretty common source of negotiations reaching an intractable state.

    But the evidence for being convinced of that is, to put it mildly, sparse.

    The Teamsters statements fit perfectly fine with the above, but just as well as simply with having obtained a more acceptable to them contract for themselves (for whatever reason) so, having something than they felt was better than nothing, had a vested interest in the Bakers conceding that had nothing to do with (and could be at odds with) the Bakerís interest.

    Really the later really would be the case even in your scenario suggestion, too.
    Last edited by Dwight; 11-16-12 at 08:31 PM.

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    So people should just accept when they are forced into a bad situation and not seek to change it? That's not very American. We should meekly accept the lot given to us? I thought striving and taking risks is something we reward in this country.
    People should use their brains and commen sense. Hostess has been struggling for years just to stay in business. Company after company after company, from mega-corporations to mom-and-pop groceries are struggling to stay in business, asking employees for concessions in return for still having a damned job. Most people with two sparking brain cells look at the global economic crisis, the unemployment crisis in America, and think, "what's better for me? Having a job with less money and fewer benefits, but still bringing cash into my pocket, or meekly accepting that my employer is unable to give me what I want, so I should close the company down so we can have another 18,500 jobless people on the street?"

    This was a no-brainer. And that Bakers union not only had no brains, they now have no jobs, and they took 7,000 other people who were willing to compromise for the good of everyone down with them.

    So, how did "seeking to change that bad situation" work out for them? This wasn't rocket science. They'll get no sympathy from me.

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by roughdraft274 View Post
    Breaking News:

    Company that makes **** products goes out of business.
    Their products are not ****.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    And for some people, that can mean the difference between making your rent or not. Or being able to afford an expensive medical procedure for your child. The difference in pay looks pretty small when you describe it as the difference between the numbers 18 and 20. But it can mean a whole lot more than that to those bakers.

    Frankly, I think we'll be better off without Twinkies. Though I'll have to wonder what we'll eat when the zombie apocalypse comes. Twinkies were a staple of the 28 Days Later diet.
    ok, so what's the difference between 18 an hour and 0 an hour make a difference in?

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    People should use their brains and commen sense. Hostess has been struggling for years just to stay in business. Company after company after company, from mega-corporations to mom-and-pop groceries are struggling to stay in business, asking employees for concessions in return for still having a damned job. Most people with two sparking brain cells look at the global economic crisis, the unemployment crisis in America, and think, "what's better for me? Having a job with less money and fewer benefits, but still bringing cash into my pocket, or meekly accepting that my employer is unable to give me what I want, so I should close the company down so we can have another 18,500 jobless people on the street?"

    This was a no-brainer. And that Bakers union not only had no brains, they now have no jobs, and they took 7,000 other people who were willing to compromise for the good of everyone down with them.

    So, how did "seeking to change that bad situation" work out for them? This wasn't rocket science. They'll get no sympathy from me.
    Next year.... Twinkies are made in China. Whatcha wanna bet?

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    So people should just accept when they are forced into a bad situation and not seek to change it? That's not very American. We should meekly accept the lot given to us? I thought striving and taking risks is something we reward in this country.
    Striving and taking risks as individuals is fine but not when it relates to taking down people who are opposed to your ideas with you.

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight View Post
    Or. An example of management screwing up so badly that the company could not afford to pay wages that people will accept rather than no job.

    Or. An example of brands losing some luster because of shifting market preferences (concerns over nutritional value).

    Or, to put the above all together: Ownership insistence of some set profit margin that was not in line with market realities of operating expenses and product demand.

    So now it all get ripped down into pieces and becomes fertilizer for, hopefully, more competent management with a more market appropriate vision. *shrug*
    Or these people have skills that will get land them a job somewhere else? Or more like them landing in the unemployment line...

    Union zombies, think for yourselves or BOHICA.
    Last edited by Μολὼν λαβέ; 11-16-12 at 11:54 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Generalizations are stupid.
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    The Second Amendment has nothing to do with guns.

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by Μολὼν λαβέ View Post
    Or these people have skills that will get land them a job somewhere else? Or more like them landing in the unemployment line...

    Union zombies, think for yourselves or BOHICA.
    They don't have any skills - that's why they need the unions to protect them in the first place. Anyone can do what they do. The machines do most of the work, most of these workers just pour cake mix into a blender and let the machines do the rest.

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight View Post
    They need to man up! That isn’t the other guy’s problem!

    My guess is for the current wage? There are breaking points, people have their price. *shrug*
    Yes, they need to man up. That would be closing down and liquidating the company since the first instance of their bankruptcy in 2004. The company didn't man up but dragged on into 2012 which gave rise to the workers having their jobs and incomes for so long. What a travesity!

    Certainly, that isn't the other guy's problem. It certainly isn't the now defunct company's problem that all the workers now have no job.

    Congratulation is now in order. The bakers' union won. The company's mismanagement is no longer their problem. The little David defeated the giant Goliath. Everybody can now go home singing kumbaya. Now enjoy your thankgiving and merry Christmas for a victorious good fight. America can now go on without the unheathy fat-laden junk foods stuffing their waistlines.

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    Re: Twinkies maker Hostess going out of business

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    So people should just accept when they are forced into a bad situation and not seek to change it? That's not very American. We should meekly accept the lot given to us? I thought striving and taking risks is something we reward in this country.
    Or they can just go look for a better job somewhere else like any other decent Americans who find themselves in such a bad situation.

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