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Thread: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    May I ask what the job market is like at the moment in the US? I know I can get facts and figures from the net, but it would be good to hear from real Americans on that.

    In the UK, jobs are still hard to come by. Austerity measures are not working, causing the double dip recession. Manufacturing still being outsourced to China etc. Construction industry is not moving. Looks like more of the same for 2013. We should be in recovery by now.

    Although I have not seen Hostess products in the UK, I am aware of some of the brands from US TV. Whatever the real reasons behind bankruptcy of that company, it's always alarming to see that amount of people lose their jobs.

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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I really don't think the union acted in the best interests of those members.
    That depends on whether or not you believe the Union line of hoping the new owners, after liquidation, would provide better contracts/benefits. As that is why they say they would not agree to the current proposal.
    The Union forced it into liquidation. Period.

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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by OpportunityCost View Post
    T

    Your sad little tirade is quite typical of you, so full of fury and so lacking in substance. Its borderline baiting with the stereotyping and the trained animal reference. Your mistake is thinking you are being rational, you are rationalizing your behavior and can't find the difference.
    What is sad is your personal attack upon me.
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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dickieboy View Post
    Start with the title of the thread…



    Why? You don't...
    Now that was not very nice.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Oh, I'm not saying management didn't do totally unethical things. But for the union to recommend that their members strike the company out of business (if that is, in fact, what happens....and they aren't given another opportunity to change their minds), I just don't think that was the right advice. Do you?

    It's my understanding they'd seen the books. They knew the bankruptcy judge had agreed with the imposition of an altered contract. They'd been offered the same as the Teamster's -- a 25% interest in the company -- and, if I recall, the company was willing to sign a promissary note for $X millions.

    I really don't think the union acted in the best interests of those members. If they should get another chance (which, I think, could happen), and they turn it down -- no sympathy from me. But I think the union convinced them the company was bluffing. And I don't think that was in their best interests at all.
    You could be totally right Maggie. Your view of the total landscape could be the accurate and wise one.

    I do think that the union wants to protect its members and makes their decisions as to what they think is the best. And they do so with local input. So I will not second guess the local union which has tons more information at their fingertips - not to mention the input of the actual members - than you or I or any media outlet could have.
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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Now that was not very nice.
    Oh...the utter hypocracy...
    "The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure" - 2006 Senator Obama...leadership failure indeed!

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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    What is sad is your personal attack upon me.
    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    You are new here. Allow me to illuminate the darkness for you: Pavlov's bell has rung and the creatures of the right which hate unions as a matter of knee jerk reflex have salivated and attacked as a matter of course. The details do not matter. the facts do not matter. Reality does not matter.

    The only thing that matters is that is is a chance for the warriors of the right to bash unions.

    In a week or two or three it will be something else that fuels the rabid anti-union fires. The people defending Hostess here do NOT give a damn about the company, their employees or their products. It is merely an excuse to continue their war on unions.
    Dont launch broadside personal attacks against union critics then whine when you are called irrational.

    This passive agressive crap you keep playing is really getting old.

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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    A corporation isn't a charity. Its about money.
    And employees dont work for free either.
    Happy Hanukkah Cheerfull Kwanzaa
    Happy Christmas Merry New Year Festivus for the rest of us

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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by OpportunityCost View Post
    Dont launch broadside personal attacks against union critics then whine when you are called irrational.

    This passive agressive crap you keep playing is really getting old.
    How does making a personal attack against me negate the vitriolic attacks made against unions in this thread?
    __________________________________________________ _
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    re: Hostess threatens to lay off 18,000 employees unless strike ends[W:521]

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Just playing the devil's advocate here because I think that most modern unions blow, but from the labor perspective -- big picture -- you don't have much bargaining power if you demonstrate 100% of the time that you will cave in and accept management's demands.
    true

    when I was a young attorney we had to deal with about 15 grievances in a three week period after going almost 2 years with almost none. So i show up at the Union hall to meet with the steward over what was clearly BS grievances-one involved a guy running a forklift into the wall, another guy didn't set a brake on a lift and it went into a stack of pallets full of forgings, and in another case a guy got into a fight with a supervisor.

    so I go in to the arbitration expecting to kick some but when the Local's President pulls me aside and said

    hey kid, we aren't gonna fight these things. I looked at him and said what? he said elections are a few weeks out, we gotta look like we are doing something. so some of our stewards are a bit overzealous OK I said. so we pretended to make a big deal out of things, and we won all the grievances. if unions want to justify their dues they have to look like they are fighting for their members. the effective ones were like this local that was upfront with management though. because they would tell us when a grievance had real merit.

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