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Thread: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    It's not that I'm offended or anything.

    But is it entirely nessecary for you to label every single type of person you disagree with as a "tard" in one form or another.
    Considering the fact Romney's record is just as or more abysmal than Obama's regarding the 2nd amendment only a tard would say "this is why we need to elect Mitt Romney." Because anyone actually intelligent and honest would agree that when it comes to the 2nd amendment Romney is no better and that 2nd amendment supporters have just as much to fear from Romney as they would Obama regarding the 2nd amendment. Both men would sign another Brady Bill or one that was much worse than the Brady bill if they didn't have to worry about negative political consequences. People should quit assuming that just because someone is a republican that they are conservative, care about the constitution,or that the people they appoint care about the constitution.
    Last edited by jamesrage; 10-26-12 at 12:45 PM.
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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Can I get an Amen to that brothers and sisters AMMENNN
    "Those who do not learn from history and condemned to relive it".

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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    That's one thing I never understand about the Left, you'd think big govt left would want to follow the Constitution to the letter to make sure we have the best govt possible.
    If “big government” obeyed the Constitution, it wouldn't be nearly so big. Those on the left do not want the Constitution obeyed, because doing so limits government, and they do not want government to be as limited as the Constitution demands.
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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    The law makes no sense at all. Straw purchases are illegal as in buying a gun for someone else at any age. "Straw purchases are a felony violation of the Gun Control Act of 1968 for both the straw purchaser (who can also be charged with lying on Federal Form 4473) and the ultimate possessor." So every time a father buys a weapon for say his son from a licenced dealer, it is a felony. The Federal laws on straw purchases does not distinguish between people who are purchasing on behalf of a family member, friend for a gift etc of age who legally can purchase or possess a firearm, and one who is not.

    Guns laws in this country make absolutely no sense at all.
    "Gift" purchases would bypass the usual background checks. Should I be able to buy a gun as a "gift" for my four-time-felon cousin?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    If “big government” obeyed the Constitution, it wouldn't be nearly so big. Those on the left do not want the Constitution obeyed, because doing so limits government, and they do not want government to be as limited as the Constitution demands.
    If you're really so against "big government," you should stop voting Republican.
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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Your prediction of our political responses, just indicates how you feel about this. Also the lack of your own disappointment over a decision that obviously contradicts the 2nd Amendment. That's one thing I never understand about the Left, you'd think big govt left would want to follow the Constitution to the letter to make sure we have the best govt possible. But no, it's the small govt types that promote adherence to the Constitution. Here we are with an obvious ruling against the 2nd Amend, and all the matters to you is how your opponents will respond; **** the Constitution.
    Nah, to honest I don't give a **** about the decision one way or the other. On reflection I'm glad that the court recognized that states have the right to legislate reasonable safety restrictions, notwithstanding the 2d Amendment right. It's consistent with Heller. Hard for a conservative to argue against this, as the court relied on original intent in making its decision.

    And of course I'm glad it was a Bush appointee and not a Dem appointee as otherwise the whole discussion would be a silly attack on liberals.
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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    I'm kinda torn on this issue.

    On the one hand, it is more than a little silly that an 18yo can join the military and be issued a selective fire autorifle and (for instance) set to guard the entrance to a military facility... can vote, marry, contract and smoke... but cannot drink or buy a handgun. YET the 18yo can buy a rifle or shotgun, which is far deadlier than any handgun... just not so readily concealable (actually there are some shotguns and carbines that are quite concealable with a little forethought and efforts... )

    OTOH studies in recent years have revealed that the human brain doesn't fully develop in all ways until about 21 or 22... especially the impulse-control part.

    BUT then again, the single biggest killer of teenagers by far isn't guns... it is CARS. Yet denying them a driver's licence would make it hard for them to have a job, at least in areas like mine where public transportation is non-existent.


    I started shooting at age 5, had a shotgun at age 12, and a pistol at age 15. I've never shot an innocent person either by accident or on purpose. My son has grown up around guns as I did and could recite the Three Rules of safe gunhandling verbatim long before he needed to shave.

    OTOH I know 18yo's I'd hate to see with a gun.

    On the other, other hand, it isn't like getting a pistol via illegal sources is at all difficult if the young person had ill intent.




    Sometimes I think we just need to fricking make up our minds whether adulthood is at 18 or 21 and quit splitting it.

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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Nah, to honest I don't give a **** about the decision one way or the other. On reflection I'm glad that the court recognized that states have the right to legislate reasonable safety restrictions, notwithstanding the 2d Amendment right. It's consistent with Heller. Hard for a conservative to argue against this, as the court relied on original intent in making its decision.

    And of course I'm glad it was a Bush appointee and not a Dem appointee as otherwise the whole discussion would be a silly attack on liberals.
    Hardly considering the militia age was considered 18-45. Plenty of Republican appointees have turned about to be liberal. Reagan had that happen plenty. So there is no guarantee.
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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    I'm kinda torn on this issue.

    On the one hand, it is more than a little silly that an 18yo can join the military and be issued a selective fire autorifle and (for instance) set to guard the entrance to a military facility... can vote, marry, contract and smoke... but cannot drink or buy a handgun. YET the 18yo can buy a rifle or shotgun, which is far deadlier than any handgun... just not so readily concealable (actually there are some shotguns and carbines that are quite concealable with a little forethought and efforts... )

    OTOH studies in recent years have revealed that the human brain doesn't fully develop in all ways until about 21 or 22... especially the impulse-control part.

    BUT then again, the single biggest killer of teenagers by far isn't guns... it is CARS. Yet denying them a driver's licence would make it hard for them to have a job, at least in areas like mine where public transportation is non-existent.


    I started shooting at age 5, had a shotgun at age 12, and a pistol at age 15. I've never shot an innocent person either by accident or on purpose. My son has grown up around guns as I did and could recite the Three Rules of safe gunhandling verbatim long before he needed to shave.

    OTOH I know 18yo's I'd hate to see with a gun.

    On the other, other hand, it isn't like getting a pistol via illegal sources is at all difficult if the young person had ill intent.




    Sometimes I think we just need to fricking make up our minds whether adulthood is at 18 or 21 and quit splitting it.
    Your arguments against are emotional, re-read them.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Your arguments against are emotional, re-read them.

    Um, no, not really.


    Studies on brain development: Science.

    Some 18yo's I'd hate to see armed: personal and rational evaluation as someone who teaches people to shoot... including teaching children to shoot.


    You could call the latter "personal opinion"... but not "emotional".

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    Re: Fifth Circuit Upholds Ban on Gun Sales to People Under 21

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Um, no, not really.


    Studies on brain development: Science.

    Some 18yo's I'd hate to see armed: personal and rational evaluation as someone who teaches people to shoot... including teaching children to shoot.


    You could call the latter "personal opinion"... but not "emotional".
    Lots of people have no brains in their twenties, so maybe we should raise the age to 30. Don't take offense.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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