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Thread: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Smooth Bro. Real smooth.
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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Just more Democratic attacks against conventional Christianity, while condemning any criticism of the religion of Islam. Their bizarre contradictory religious bigotries are tiresome.

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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    That we should force a woman who has been raped to endure the pregnancy brought on by her rapist. That is wrong, period.
    Which is dealing with a seperate issue from what he said.

    Believing that even bad things that occur is "God's Will" is one part of the equation.

    The other part of the equation is suggesting that laws keep women that are raped from aborting.

    There's nothing "disgusting" in believing or stating, in general, that a child concieved out of a horrible and tragic situation like Rape is still part of God's Will. That's no more "disgusting" than saying that a Child born to a mother who dies in child birth is "God's Will". Or stating that if one loses their job that it's "God's Will". It's a consistent notion within many Chrisitians...the notion that, GOOD or BAD, things happen in this world according to god's plan and that god sends nothing our way we aren't capable of handling. It's a mentality that allows some Christians to maintain a positive outlook or attitude when the situation around them is very bad, because it's a representation that hope can come from it. This mentality or thought process is hardly one that is foreign to people...but they like to get up in arms about it when it is applied to something they think is "too bad" for it. Essentially, people get upset that an individual is consistent.

    There's nothing inherently "disgusting" about that thought process.

    The SECOND part of the situation is allowing that thought process to encourage an individual to push for certain types of legislation. If you find that legislation "disgusting" then I think that's understandable. I may disagree to a certain degree, but I can at least fathom how that can be "disgusting". However, the two things are not muturally exclusive. One can easily believe the first while at the same time oppose attempts to make abortion illegal even in the cases of rape. That's specifically because the two are two actual seperate issues

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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    This is brought to you by the party of "the bitch deserved it".
    Brought to you by the party of "Slaughter the Chlidren".



    Done with your hackiness now?

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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Which is dealing with a seperate issue from what he said.

    Believing that even bad things that occur is "God's Will" is one part of the equation.

    The other part of the equation is suggesting that laws keep women that are raped from aborting.

    There's nothing "disgusting" in believing or stating, in general, that a child concieved out of a horrible and tragic situation like Rape is still part of God's Will. That's no more "disgusting" than saying that a Child born to a mother who dies in child birth is "God's Will". Or stating that if one loses their job that it's "God's Will". It's a consistent notion within many Chrisitians...the notion that, GOOD or BAD, things happen in this world according to god's plan and that god sends nothing our way we aren't capable of handling. It's a mentality that allows some Christians to maintain a positive outlook or attitude when the situation around them is very bad, because it's a representation that hope can come from it. This mentality or thought process is hardly one that is foreign to people...but they like to get up in arms about it when it is applied to something they think is "too bad" for it. Essentially, people get upset that an individual is consistent.

    There's nothing inherently "disgusting" about that thought process.

    The SECOND part of the situation is allowing that thought process to encourage an individual to push for certain types of legislation. If you find that legislation "disgusting" then I think that's understandable. I may disagree to a certain degree, but I can at least fathom how that can be "disgusting". However, the two things are not muturally exclusive. One can easily believe the first while at the same time oppose attempts to make abortion illegal even in the cases of rape. That's specifically because the two are two actual seperate issues
    The man running for congress wants to make abortion illegal, even in cases of rape. That is disgusting.
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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Gehrig View Post
    Except that the "folks" you're defending aren't sentient because they lack the very biological prerequisites to sentience. They don't care whether they live or die, because they literally, physically cannot possibly care. So yes, your prioritization of something that has no more sense nor purpose than a stone is wholly misguided.
    A newborn Homo sapiens isn't sapient. It's a milk to poop engine, and an inefficient one at that. A newborn has its human rights protected, however.


    I have every right to shoot someone that won't leave my house.
    Agreed, if someone breaks in to your home, you may shoot them. Your act would be defensive, not aggressive, and violates no one's rights.

    I certainly have the right to shoot someone whom is hijacking my entire metabolism against my will.
    Does not follow.

    a) In the overwhelming majority of cases, you brought that someone into existence through your own deliberate action. If you invite your neighbor in, you can't then shoot them in self defense for trespassing. There's a relatively early Simpsons reference to be had here, but I'll move on. The fact that in this case you're causing your "neighbor" to exist doesn't take away from the argument, mind, it adds to it.

    b) Even in the rape scenario, this justification fails. A home invader is an aggressor - you are permitted to shoot them in part because they have violated your rights and they demonstrably have no respect for you and may be assumed to continue to aggress and harm you. Self-defense is appropriate against a home invader? Who is the aggressor in this absurdly uncommon yet far overly discussed "rape pregnancy" scenario ? The rapist.

    Lets be clear - if you get the opportunity, by all means, kill that guy and get away. That would be self-defense. Of course, you're talking about claiming "self-defense" against a third party some months later, someone who has not violated your rights, has not engaged in aggression against you, and may not be assumed to have the aforementioned negative intentions on account of the fact that they are objectively innocent. That is quite a perversion of "self-defense."

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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    The man running for congress wants to make abortion illegal, even in cases of rape. That is disgusting.
    And as I said, I can understand viewing that as "disgusting". I simply disagree with your earlier suggestions that all of what he said, IE the notion regarding the belief of "God's will", is "disgusting". And that one part is not intrinsically part of the other

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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Quote Originally Posted by varium103 View Post
    It is not our goal to figure out God's intentions, but rather obey his commands so that we may be part of his intentions.
    We have no obligation to follow "God's intentions." Our laws are secular and based on human reason (at least they should be), not on religious superstition. Superstition is one of the biggest problems our country faces. It's fading faster in other countries, but we cling to this irrationality. The sooner every single religion in in the US dies, the better off we'll be. We'll be free of absurd arguments like "God wanted her to be raped and impregnated." "Religion" and "superstition" are words that should be used interchangeably. They're one and the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    Which is disgusting, that God values all life, or that life shouldn't be taken for convenience?
    A zygote is not a human baby any more than your sperm cells are. It's a collection of cells that has human DNA, but has not yet developed a heartbeat or brainwaves. Ending an early pregnancy via Plan B is no more killing a child than your letting your sperm cells die or me letting an egg cell die. Later when the fetus is more developed, the issue is muddier, but it's still the woman's body and still her moral decision to make. However, right-wing extremists even brand a Plan B pregnancy prevention an abortion.

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Just more Democratic attacks against conventional Christianity, while condemning any criticism of the religion of Islam. Their bizarre contradictory religious bigotries are tiresome.
    All religion deserves criticism. Without exception, every religion in the world relies on emotional and illogical misinformation. The sooner we reject all of it, the better. We would be a more advanced species if there were no more religion. It's a relic of the past from a time when humans lacked the capacity to explain the world scientifically. It's caused more wars and more misery than anything else in history. It's not bigotry to expose preposterous religious claims. It's logic and critical thinking.

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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    From my knowledge of Calvinism, everyone is a sinner, thanks to Adam. He's already chosen the people to be saved, and their actions, evil or good, are irrelevant to their salvation, and so any evil they commit is part of a larger plan.
    Exactly, and that plan is entirely under the omniscient eye of God and his omnipotent will, or grace, to direct accordingly. To me this has always suggested that the Calvinist God is very different from the God of other denominations, as he is both good and evil, supplies both comfort and torture according to his whim. From this position comes that most heartless 'comfort' of being asked to "love what we cannot understand, but trust in God's plan and His boundless love". In La Peste (The Plague) Camus gave this very short shrift:

    "No Father, I have a very different idea of love, and to my dying day I will refuse to love that Creation where His children are tortured".

    He also said, in the same novel: “For who would dare to assert that eternal happiness can compensate for a single moment's human suffering”

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    re: Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, "God intended" it [W:266]

    Quote Originally Posted by Anagram View Post
    Indiana Republican: When life begins from rape, God intended it | Reuters



    Honestly, I think it is a reasonable and somewhat consistent position, although I don't agree with it. From the standpoint of someone trying to get elected in a close race with an unusually strong Libertarian candidate to splinter the Republican vote, it was just a stupid thing to say though. If it plays anything like Todd Akin's comment did, Joe Donnelly will take the senate seat from the Republicans in Indiana. I'd pretty much given up hope for the Republicans to take the senate this year anyway. Things looking very good for the GOP in 2014 though.
    I don't see how it's a reasonable comment, Anagram.
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