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Thread: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

  1. #21
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Quote Originally Posted by jerry7 View Post
    It's news that Holder's own investigator cleared him? LOL!!!
    Clearly, the only way this not-guilty verdict would have satisfied you would be if the investigation were conducted by an independent investigator hand picked by Congressman Issa himself. I wound at what point will people start to set their partisanship aside and allow professional ethics and integrity rule the day?

    Republicans had their day in court (so to speak). Chief Justice Holder was cleared of the charge of having fore-knowledge of the Fast and Furious gun running scandal. Eleven members of the Obama Administration won't get away unpunished, however. Nonetheless, time to let it go and move on. Don't be bitter and do as Congressman Issa did attempting to the issue to drum up additional faults against Justice Holder and President Obama as the book is closed on this case.

    In his own statement, Issa said, "Contrary to the denials of the attorney general and his political defenders in Congress, the investigation found that information in wiretap applications approved by senior Justice Department officials in Washington did contain red flags showing reckless tactics and faults Attorney General Eric Holder’s inner circle for their conduct.

    It’s time for President Obama to step in and provide accountability for officials at both the Department of Justice and ATF who failed to do their jobs."
    Tacky for sure! Just admit defeat and move on.

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    What does that say about Holder's management? He didn't know what was going on and thus he is innocent? Instead of innocent, it seems more like incompetent. Incompetence is not a crime, but it is a shame.
    It's not incompetence when members from the ATF kept information from senior Justice Department officials. Maybe those individuals were attempting to cover their own butts. Maybe the ATF didn't want to involve another department concerning their screw up. Maybe senior DOJ officials below Chief Justice Holder didn't want to involve him in the ordeal. Whatever the case, it's pretty clear Holder knew very little about FF BEFORE the scandal broke loose. So, as I said above, let it go, folks. There's nothing more to see here.

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    No, I'm not even going to raise my voice.

    But it's more than just a wee naive to think, with all the facts that we do have, that the DOJ has been forthcoming. It stalled for, what, a year, on the Congressional committee's "request" for e-mails and etc.?

    Ya, inquiring minds do want to know why. And by the way, an American lost his life because of "Fast and Furious." His name is Brian Terry.
    The "hide/destroy the evidence" montra isn't new. You do recall the Iran/Contra Affair from the Reagan era, right? What did Col. Oliver North do? Answer: Exactly what he was told and destroyed evidence. While there is no evidence such actions were taken here w/FF, I get what you're eluding to. Unfortunately, it makes the Republican decree to "search for the truth" seem quite hollow after the fact.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 09-19-12 at 09:13 PM.

  2. #22
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Then what is it when your underlings are so poorly managed that an operation of this scope is concealed from you? The ATFE hasn't had leadership for years now. Whose fault is that? Holder, Obama, Romney, Objective Voice or Specklebang? Please pick one from that list. If it's my fault, I'll take full responsibility and if it's not my fault, I hope someone will.

    I hope you know my POV on this isn't partisan. It just seems like a giant management failure and I tend to blame the managers, not the flunkies. Of course, I could be wrong....

    It's not incompetence when members from the ATF kept information from senior Justice Department officials. Maybe those individuals were attempting to cover their own butts. Maybe the ATF didn't want to involve another department concerning their screw up. Maybe senior DOJ officials below Chief Justice Holder didn't want to involve him in the ordeal. Whatever the case, it's pretty clear Holder knew very little about FF BEFORE the scandal broke loose. So, as I said above, let it go, folks. There's nothing more to see here.

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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    What was that? I couldn't hear you over the gnashing of teeth coming from the conspiracy brigade!


    So "un-indicted co-consperator" now means innocent?

    Who woulda thunk it.
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

  4. #24
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    What was that? I couldn't hear you over the gnashing of teeth coming from the conspiracy brigade!
    One of the top Obama appointees was implicated in the cover up. Pretty damning

  5. #25
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I'm sure they'll just move onto the next ginned up "scandal".

    Conducting an operation in which "only" 2000 guns are lost to the hands of drug lords is a ginned up scandal? And the cover up? And the obstruction? And the illegal invocation of the executive privilege?

    Is it only ginned up if the Democrat party is behind it?
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

  6. #26
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Well if the Fast and Furious outrage was about justice sure...everybody agrees with the outcome and glad the issue was brought up.

    This tying it to Obama is the ginned up portion.


    I thought they were only trying to tie it to Holder. You know, the guy that Obama is protecting by illegally using Executive Privilege to obstruct the investigation?
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

  7. #27
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Quote Originally Posted by specklebang View Post
    What does that say about Holder's management? He didn't know what was going on and thus he is innocent? Instead of innocent, it seems more like incompetent. Incompetence is not a crime, but it is a shame.


    He is avoiding blame where he should be forced to resign in disgrace.

    Sounds to me like he's pretty good at what he does.
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

  8. #28
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Unless the President picks up the phone, calls his lawyer, and pays him out of his own pocket, I do not believe any of it should be protected by privilege of any kind. If it is not real national security and it is paid for with public dollars, people should have a right to see it regardless of whose party is in the WH.

  9. #29
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Quote Originally Posted by Hairytic View Post
    What documents did Obama hold back from the congressional hearing? Holder handed over everything and then some. Issa wanted something that didn't exist. Now that Holder has been cleared, we know Issa was just playing politics by trying to drum up a scandal where there was none.

    About 70,000 docs and emails were withheld from the Congressional Investigators and many of the docs that you say did not exist were eventually turned over to the inspector General.

    Failure to turn over the docs and emails under subpoena might be a separation of powers violation.
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

  10. #30
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    Re: ‘Fast & Furious' operation: Justice probe clears Eric Holder

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Ah, I see. So the investigation didn't give you what you wanted. So conspiracy it is.



    Appeal to emotion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    This White House makes the Nixon White house look like the cleanest and most trustworthy group since Mother Theresa had a Rosary night.
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

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