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Thread: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    It's a crappy movie. Got it.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    Who's "defending" these people? You make it seem as though to acknowledge that yes, they are also covered by the First Amendment, is somehow sympathizing with their film. That is a very small viewpoint.

    If you don't stand up for principle for people you disagree with or don't like, then you don't believe in that principle. I challenge YOU to think about that.

    I also challenge you to condemn the lunatics who kill people over a film which no one's seen, rather than just portray them as hapless animals who react to stimuli based only on instinct and can't be expected to live up to a modicum of rationality.
    Where am I not standing up for the principle of the first amendment? I am perfectly able to call these people what they are without denying them their right to say whatever they want. And where am I not condemning the people who carried out any violence? I said they were responsible and had no one to blame but themselves and nothing justified their actions. Did you ever read my post?

    Also I should mention its looking like the deaths in Libya are unrelated to the film, but that an armed group who had already planned an attack on the embassy used the crowd protesting the film as cover to move in and engage the embassy walls. That would make those deaths unrelated to the film at least in terms of what motivated the attacks.

    BBC News - Meeting Libya's Ansar al-Sharia

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    And if it weren't for irrational, hate filled morons sitting around waiting to murder as soon as some perceived insult comes their way, we could realize a more open and universal exercise of our rights. They were not the ones to pull the trigger, regardless of what they said. Que sera sera.
    I totally agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by Born Free View Post
    Last I heard Clubgetmo was the most recruiting tool terrorist had in recruiting more terrorist. And Obama promised to close it. Never happened, and you no longer hear from the left that Clubgetmo is a recruiting tool. Interesting how things change depending who is in office.

    Now to video's showing terrorist cutting heads off of Americans, is that not inciting violence, and burning our flag is not inciting violence here. We have rights in this country that we treasure, and you may not like what some people do, in light of those rights. But that is really do bad. If your incensed by what some people do then I suggest you take your displeasure out on our forefathers in writing our constitution.

    Last, I don't support what those people did in making that film, but I do support their right to do so. And I would never support changing our constitution to tramp on our values for the likes of others who disagree with us.

    My anger is directed at those bastards that killed Americans at our embassy, not at someone making a film, as bad as that film may be.
    You're right Gitmo is a recruiting tool, but bring it up here is a total Red Herring. Your line of logic is basically "Because Obama never closed Gitmo, and the left doesn't complain about it, and because its a propaganda tool, that I can't complain about giving the enemy another propaganda too." Sorry but my opinions aren't dependent on what the "Left" or Obama says. Also our Forefathers would recognize my right to be pissed off at this guy as much as his right to piss people off with his speech, I don't know how many ****ing times I have to say I'm not in any way shape or form saying anyone doesn't have the right to free speech, but simply having the right to free speech doesn't mean you have the right for that speech to be free of criticism.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Or perhaps a Muslim, keeping in mind that Islamic leasers added to those Danish cartoons which drove Muslims wild.

    It's seems you'll easily buy the idea that an elderly Jew was somehow involved, despite the lack of any evidence.
    The evidence is in the NPR articles which where the result of an investigation by their reporters into who the producer was since he used a fake name. You've commented on a story which you clearly haven't read and made yourself out to be an idiot by denying something clearly stated in the story, congratulations. So yes the man may be an elderly Jewish man, or perhaps he's a Egyptian Coptic Christian, or perhaps he doesn't exist at all and the film was produced by 2 or more people jointly and they decided to use this one fake name for the producer role.

    By the way I hope to Christ you aren't suggesting any anti-Semitic feelings on my part.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Nevermind the violent and intolerant human garbage the attacked and murded innocent, unarmed people. It's not their fault. Right?
    I never said that and you know I didn't. Go **** yourself dude

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    Can't we all just get along?!!!

    Honestly though...there's multiple threads discussing the actual attack. Why is it off limits to discuss the move? Nobody is saying jail the guy but actions have concequences and pretend however much you want the maker of the film was most likely not just aware of the blowback but expecting it.

    Apparently the user comment on Youtube said something like "this a 100% American movie you cows". It was obviously goading and hoping for a response.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    It doesn't seem much worse than the average Family Guy episode that mocks Jesus and Christianity

    I'm offended by it, but I brush it off and continue to laugh at the funny parts (although, South Park > Family Guy). Freedom of speech is wonderful and should be respected. No apology should be issued, it should all be condemnation of the barbarians that murdered people and attacked US embassies.
    A filmmaker makes a film to evoke something, convey a message, demonstrate their point. While US Freedom of Speech guarantees are not applicable in Egypt/Libya these people could and should have simply discussed or protested peaceably, if that were the reason they were formed a mob and rioted . That is simply a means of societal self preservation, if nothing else. I hardly think that these people act like this when they hear of something they disagree within in their own religious or social constructs.




    People who are practicing members of a religion of peace do not commit acts that are not peaceful. There is nothing genuine about these people or their supposed reason for becoming savage animals whio were instruments of mayhem and death.

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    People who are practicing members of a religion of peace do not commit acts that are not peaceful. There is nothing genuine about these people or their supposed reason for becoming savage animals whio were instruments of mayhem and death.
    there were mobs protesting but it was a small group that got violent. In fact both government condemn the attack. Let's not forget! Libya actually voted AGAINST the Islamist party that was running in their elections.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Can't we all just get along?!!!

    Honestly though...there's multiple threads discussing the actual attack. Why is it off limits to discuss the move? Nobody is saying jail the guy but actions have concequences and pretend however much you want the maker of the film was most likely not just aware of the blowback but expecting it.

    Apparently the user comment on Youtube said something like "this a 100% American movie you cows". It was obviously goading and hoping for a response.
    Once the reaction becomes completely disproportionate to the situation, I do not likewise escalate my criticism of the film makers. Sorry.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    Where am I not standing up for the principle of the first amendment?
    By implying that merely stating they're protected by the First Amendment is "defending" them. I haven't seen anyone defend the video. Have you? Can you point me to it?

    And where am I not condemning the people who carried out any violence? I said they were responsible and had no one to blame but themselves and nothing justified their actions. Did you ever read my post?
    I admit that I missed part of your post the first time around, and it is wrong to say that you didn't condemn them.

    But the rest of what I said stands -- why is it necessary to then turn around and condemn the people who made the video? You're the one who links the two. If "nothing" justifies what the mob did, then why is the condemnation also in order? It's a ridiculous video, but they didn't kill anyone.


    Also I should mention its looking like the deaths in Libya are unrelated to the film, but that an armed group who had already planned an attack on the embassy used the crowd protesting the film as cover to move in and engage the embassy walls. That would make those deaths unrelated to the film at least in terms of what motivated the attacks.
    Yes, I already posted this, and it makes the self-flagellation even less appropriate.
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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Once the reaction becomes completely disproportionate to the situation, I do not likewise escalate my criticism of the film makers. Sorry.
    I'm not saying that's the case. At the same time...this is the response the film maker was going for! This wasn't a film for neo-nazi's to jerk off to. This was produced for a reaction from the Muslim community. These folks relish in the idea that they will cause conflict.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    It's a crappy movie. Got it.
    Exactly. The movie is NOT the issue, crappy or not, our first amendment or not, the radical muslims in the ME (the ones who ARE asshole terrorists) will look for and find ANY excuse to go off the rails with righteous indignation. The only solution for folks like that is an infusion of lead and copper. If we leave them alone, they will not go away. They cannot be appeased or reasoned with.

    I'm not calling for a war against muslims at all. However, we should expect harsh treatment of the radical sort by their own governments. Anything else and they never, ever, ever, get anything from us or any of our trading partners.

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    Re: "Innocence of Muslims" the film that caused the protests

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    By implying that merely stating they're protected by the First Amendment is "defending" them. I haven't seen anyone defend the video. Have you? Can you point me to it?
    I disagree with the intentions behind the making of such movie, as I suspect it's a blow to Muslim in particular and not organized religion in general, but I 100% support the right to make it, I think the response of Muslims to ideas that hurt their delicate sensibilities is insane and find the idea of mocking any religion's stupid superstitions and non-logic hilarious.

    My quibble is over which religion is in the crosshairs. It's stupid, to me, to target one over others. They all deserve it.

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