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Thread: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Sam Bacile should get an Oscar for this film.

    Mr. and Mrs. Bacile must be so proud of their son.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Yes, freedom of speech is part of what we defend, fight and die for. I will admit to being unsure of where the line between legal speech, and speech designed to incite violence is... because SCOTUS has clearly opined that not all speech is free speech.

    When it comes to speech which is designed to incite violence, as this film clearly was, then I don't believe it's covered by constitutional freedoms. Since when are Americans allowed freedom of speech which is designed to get other people, including other Americans, killed? Someone said we should stop the "barbarians". Okay. How? How many countries do we bomb into extinction before all the "barbarians" are destroyed? We're clearly not very good at merely conquering countries, and schooling them to our superior ways. How many people are we willing to kill? How many of our own people are we willing to kill?

    This is not a black-and-white, beat-our-chests-for-the-constitution issue. It is a global issue.

    In a perfect world, the US would gather intelligence leading to the actual perpetrators of the destruction/murders at the Libyan consulant, shove a couple of drone strikes up their ass and show the rest of the rabble what they can expect if they **** with us. It's not a perfect world, though. So... how many people should we kill to protect our constitutional freedom to insult other religions. I'm just asking.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    Yes, freedom of speech is part of what we defend, fight and die for. I will admit to being unsure of where the line between legal speech, and speech designed to incite violence is... because SCOTUS has clearly opined that not all speech is free speech.

    When it comes to speech which is designed to incite violence, as this film clearly was, then I don't believe it's covered by constitutional freedoms. Since when are Americans allowed freedom of speech which is designed to get other people, including other Americans, killed? Someone said we should stop the "barbarians". Okay. How? How many countries do we bomb into extinction before all the "barbarians" are destroyed? We're clearly not very good at merely conquering countries, and schooling them to our superior ways. How many people are we willing to kill? How many of our own people are we willing to kill?

    This is not a black-and-white, beat-our-chests-for-the-constitution issue. It is a global issue.

    In a perfect world, the US would gather intelligence leading to the actual perpetrators of the destruction/murders at the Libyan consulant, shove a couple of drone strikes up their ass and show the rest of the rabble what they can expect if they **** with us. It's not a perfect world, though. So... how many people should we kill to protect our constitutional freedom to insult other religions. I'm just asking.
    You can't hold the film maker responsible for the stupidity of others. If you do that, then you open the door to ban books and video games, too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You can't hold the film maker responsible for the stupidity of others. If you do that, then you open the door to ban books and video games, too.
    I agree... to a point. When a book, a video game, a film is designed solely to incite violence upon others, then I believe it is not covered by freedom of speech. Remember, the key here is "designed solely to incite violence". I suspect SCOTUS would agree with me.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    I agree... to a point. When a book, a video game, a film is designed solely to incite violence upon others, then I believe it is not covered by freedom of speech. Remember, the key here is "designed solely to incite violence". I suspect SCOTUS would agree with me.
    Then, we're going to ban books, games and movies that are considered racist, or sexist, or homophobic, or promote racial impurity.

    If we ban all media that pisses somebody off, then we'll have to ban all books, games and movies.

    Where do you draw the line? Are we going to ban Watership Down because someone rioted over it's content?

    At some point, we have to say, "Hey! Dumbasses! Grow the **** up or we'll stick it up your asses!". IMO, we're at that point.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Then, we're going to ban books, games and movies that are considered racist, or sexist, or homophobic, or promote racial impurity.

    If we ban all media that pisses somebody off, then we'll have to ban all books, games and movies.

    Where do you draw the line? Are we going to ban Watership Down because someone rioted over it's content?

    At some point, we have to say, "Hey! Dumbasses! Grow the **** up or we'll stick it up your asses!". IMO, we're at that point.
    You've clearly not understood what I was saying in the single sentence you pulled out of a rather lengthy post. Guess we'll just agree to disagree on this.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Quote Originally Posted by Arbo View Post
    This is some serious paint brushing of a whole group of people. I'd be willing to bet that the majority of Muslims in the world mind their own business and live their lives, like most everyone else.

    It is those that are extremists that are the problem.
    All of Islam is a problem. You recognize that now or know it later.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Does the general not also have the right to simply request something of a pastor, that may benefit the men under his command... In this case being the entire US military.

    No force involved, simply a request, which I think is fair enough.

    No ones rights violated here.
    Reverse the situation and imagine now that a general is calling to pressure New York Times reporters not to run with classified information. I see a bit more caterwauling in that alternate scenario.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    You've clearly not understood what I was saying in the single sentence you pulled out of a rather lengthy post. Guess we'll just agree to disagree on this.
    We can agree, soon as you explain how we would keep these kinds of media bannings from getting out of hand.

    I get the whole, "intent to incite violence", thing. But, who gets to judge that intent? There's no evidence that Bacile's soul intent was to incite violence. The Islamopologists have propagandized that little nugget and to their credit, it worked, but there's nothing to prove it's true.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Top US military officer calls pastor over film

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Reverse the situation and imagine now that a general is calling to pressure New York Times reporters not to run with classified information. I see a bit more caterwauling in that alternate scenario.
    I see Libbos ****ting on the headliner of their hybrids.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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