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Thread: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate Benghazi leaves 4 dead, inc. U.S. Ambassador[W:939]

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    I disagree fully.

    When a man walks into a crowded theatre and says FIRE and the reaction is panic and people die and yet there is no fire.. is he not guilty of manslaughter at least?
    There's a time scale. If you yell fire in a crowded theater, you immediately cause panic. There is reasonable cause to believe your life is in danger, and thus panic and escape are expected. Fight or flight is immediate response and if your life is in trouble, you must react immediately. If you watch a movie and then decide that you're going to burn something down because of it, you are not making a panicked decision because you think your life is on the line. You have time to reason it out and if you choose not to, then that is a choice you make. But the external pressure to your life isn't there and ultimately you go off and plan an attack...there's plenty of time to realize what it is that you're doing. The film maker is not on the line because violent reaction to a movie is not a rational response. Panicking in a fire is a rational response.
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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Why isn't this just a criminal act? Criminals murdered 4 people and people are talking about religious wars. WTF! I'm actually old enough to remember a group of black guys pulling a white trucker out of his vehicle and beating the ever loving hell out of him then celebrating what they had done. It was a horrific act but I nor most people wanted to declare a race war because of what a handful of criminals had done. There will always be criminals who want holy wars, race wars etc... but If governments keep responding in that kind of tribal mindset things will never improve.

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    Well, I didn't know he had made time for Letterman instead. I stand corrected.
    I think it's safe to say that after four years no one can ever accept anything Barrack Hussein Obama says at face value.

    Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me, and if the American electorate allows themselves to be fooled yet again then they will have entered a phase of severe dysfunctionality.

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    I disagree fully.

    When a man walks into a crowded theatre and says FIRE and the reaction is panic and people die and yet there is no fire.. is he not guilty of manslaughter at least? Now he could have gone into an empty theatre and shouted FIRE .. that is his right under freedom of speech and the reaction does not cause death and panic.. but he choose.. yes choose to walk into a crowded theatre and shout FIRE which in turn caused panic and deaths. He knew what was doing and he is responsible for his actions.

    One of the cornerstone of our societies today, and especially of the right wing political theory.. is personal responsibility. You are responsible for your life, you are responsible for your actions.. and you are responsible for your words. If ANY of those responsibilities cause harm to others.. then YOU are responsible either in part or in whole for those injuries.
    So what you are saying is that Michael Moore's films should be outlawed because they might inflame someone to violence. Please say so directly.

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    I think it's safe to say that after four years no one can ever accept anything Barrack Hussein Obama says at face value.

    Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me, and if the American electorate allows themselves to be fooled yet again then they will have entered a phase of severe dysfunctionality.
    What exactly do you mean? How have you been "fooled"?

    A film maker deiberately sets off a firestorm to express his religious beliefs and goes into hiding while Americans are being killed..

    And you want to do a petty routine on Obama?

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    I disagree fully.

    When a man walks into a crowded theatre and says FIRE and the reaction is panic and people die and yet there is no fire.. is he not guilty of manslaughter at least? Now he could have gone into an empty theatre and shouted FIRE .. that is his right under freedom of speech and the reaction does not cause death and panic.. but he choose.. yes choose to walk into a crowded theatre and shout FIRE which in turn caused panic and deaths. He knew what was doing and he is responsible for his actions.

    One of the cornerstone of our societies today, and especially of the right wing political theory.. is personal responsibility. You are responsible for your life, you are responsible for your actions.. and you are responsible for your words. If ANY of those responsibilities cause harm to others.. then YOU are responsible either in part or in whole for those injuries.
    The brunt of the responsibility falls on the shoulders of the Libyan government. They failed to protect those in their country and to maintain public safety. Us law does not apply here. There is no crowded theater. There is no US constitutional free speech argument there is only is what should Libya have done differently to maintain order and public safety.

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by sharon View Post
    And you want to do a petty routine on Obama?
    You seem to want to do a petty routine on the film maker. The people at fault, the people 100% at fault, are those who decided to act aggressively and take violent actions.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams View Post
    I call bull**** on your bull****.

    Unless someone can point to something in the film that's explicitly illegal, I'm going to go ahead and place 100% of the blame on the idiots who perpetrated the murder.

    In fact, even if you can identify something illegal in the film, I'm still going to place 100% of the blame on the people who stormed an embassy and killed an ambassador; they had nothing to do with the movie.
    Absolutely.
    This was a violent criminal act, and the people responsible are the violent criminals who carried out the attack, not someone who made a movie.

    At least the US and Libya are both on the same side in condemning the attack and swearing to bring the perpetrators to justice.

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    So you are seriously claiming that the people behind this movie which states Mohammed as a homosexual paedophile lying mass murderer were anywhere near rational when they one day woke up and said.. Hey lets make such a movie, it could be fun!? Screw the facts! That is like saying Adolf Hitler was rational when wrote Mien Kampf which did not exactly portray Jews in a positive light...
    You hardly know "the facts" about Mohammed, but who cares anyway? The point is much larger than him.

    And it is nothing like Mein Kamph. You can read it or make a movie of it and no Jews are going to kill anyone if you do.

    And do you know why? Jews are a civilized people.

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    Re: Libya: Assault on U.S. consulate in Benghazi leaves 4 dead, including U.S. Ambass

    Quote Originally Posted by sharon View Post
    What exactly do you mean? How have you been "fooled"?

    A film maker deiberately sets off a firestorm to express his religious beliefs and goes into hiding while Americans are being killed..

    And you want to do a petty routine on Obama?
    Why is it that you want anyone you don't like to be exposed to assasination by hate mongers?

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