Page 7 of 69 FirstFirst ... 567891757 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 70 of 685

Thread: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

  1. #61
    On Vacation
    joko104's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    12-03-17 @ 03:32 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    31,568
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    I was going to write a response defending their salaries but I honestly don't even think that's the issue. That same logic is never applied when asking millionaires for a tax increase in order to close down deficits....instead it's class warfare to ask people that make exponentially more money to take a cut in order to close budget deficits.

    Things like Citizens United which allow rich individuals to have a higher than 1 vote say so in how our country is run is fine in your view.

    But when middle class teachers collectively bargain to have a voice? When they get angry that deficits are closed on their back? Time to pull out the tar and feathers! I think you really have to submerse yourself in propoganda in order to have such a distorted view.
    Why do some Democrats think ever issue should be addressed with "Don't you just hate rich people!"

    This school issue has nothing to do with rich people, unless you want those remaining to move out of Chicago.

  2. #62
    Pontificator
    iliveonramen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    On a Gravy Train with Biscuit Wheels
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:35 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    9,158

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    Please show me where the average teacher's salary is $75,000 a year.
    The median is 55k so either the salaries are heavily skewed or they are including positions and salaries beyond just teaching.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  3. #63
    Banned
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Chicago Illinois
    Last Seen
    10-14-15 @ 09:28 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Private
    Posts
    56,981

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Why do some Democrats think ever issue should be addressed with "Don't you just hate rich people!"

    This school issue has nothing to do with rich people, unless you want those remaining to move out of Chicago.

    Buisness is and has been leaving over all the taxes. One of the higest Corporate taxes and Highest costs of living in the Nation. Here is another problem that is Unique of Illinois and many also believe part of the problem.....

    People in Illinois like to complain about big government. But maybe there's a bigger problem: little government. Lots and lots of them, from municipalities to townships to special districts to school districts. Every five years the Census does a census of governments, and Illinois ranks first, as it always does, with 6,968, over 2,000 more than the runner-up, Pennsylvania. And we don't just have more governments than anywhere else; we have more of just about every kind of government the Census surveys. 2007 was the last year that a detailed breakdown was available.....snip~

    Illinois: Land of 7,000 Governments - The 312 - September 2012 - Chicago



    Dark green is the highest tier, 51-538 governments and public school systems by county. Plenty of other states have most of their counties in that tier, but we're distinguished by the number of counties among states with lots of governments per county

  4. #64
    Pontificator
    iliveonramen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    On a Gravy Train with Biscuit Wheels
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:35 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    9,158

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Why do some Democrats think ever issue should be addressed with "Don't you just hate rich people!"

    This school issue has nothing to do with rich people, unless you want those remaining to move out of Chicago.
    Actually I brought up collective bargaining. It was Grim that made the play of "poor teachers only making X amount a year". If sacrafice is supposedly tied to how much you make and whether you can afford a haircut that reasoning should apply in all situations.

    Rich people won't be leaving Chicago because of tax rates.....if that's the case you'd see a huge amount of rich in Alabama and Mississippi instead of NY, California, Illinois.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  5. #65
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:52 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    89,706

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    That's not the analogy. How do you as chef end up keeping your job when you are supplied with steak as a raw material and you only serve hamburger to the people you contracted to serve?

    Again, all this obfuscation of the issue is unnecessary. We've already established the pay is there and the results are not.
    And there is the rub. A teacher can only work with the students they are given. In my high school where I taught, we gave all incoming ninth graders a math test to see where they were according to grade level skills so they could take mandated Algebra I. In an average class of 35 kids, the scores ranged all the way from second grade to tenth grade. The distribution was far from even with the average being around fifth grade. The vast vast vast majority of the 35 were not anywhere near grade level in basic arithmetic skills needed to handle Algebra.

    But now the administration says - teach them Algebra... here is your classroom .... here are your books ... here is your paycheck for doing this job.

    What is missing from the recipe?
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  6. #66
    On Vacation
    joko104's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    12-03-17 @ 03:32 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    31,568
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    Actually I brought up collective bargaining. It was Grim that made the play of "poor teachers only making X amount a year". If sacrafice is supposedly tied to how much you make and whether you can afford a haircut that reasoning should apply in all situations.

    Rich people won't be leaving Chicago because of tax rates.....if that's the case you'd see a huge amount of rich in Alabama and Mississippi instead of NY, California, Illinois.
    They move to the suburbs out of the inner cities. Its used to be called "white flight" when racial motivated. Now it is for taxes, less regulations if a business and for better schools. And there are LOTS of rich in Alabama and Mississippi. But they also stay out of the spotlight.

  7. #67
    On Vacation
    joko104's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Last Seen
    12-03-17 @ 03:32 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    31,568
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    And there is the rub. A teacher can only work with the students they are given. In my high school where I taught, we gave all incoming ninth graders a math test to see where they were according to grade level skills so they could take mandated Algebra I. In an average class of 35 kids, the scores ranged all the way from second grade to tenth grade. The distribution was far from even with the average being around fifth grade. The vast vast vast majority of the 35 were not anywhere near grade level in basic arithmetic skills needed to handle Algebra.

    But now the administration says - teach them Algebra... here is your classroom .... here are your books ... here is your paycheck for doing this job.

    What is missing from the recipe?

    THat is what is missing in this discussion. How much of the Chicago School District budget goes to administrators/administration and do they or teachers make teaching decisions? What is the average salary of the administrators and their staff? How much did their budgets go up in the last 10 years?

  8. #68
    Sage
    jet57's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    not here
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 07:27 PM
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    24,680

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    It's all over the internet -- the school system isn't as transparent as it should be, but $75,000 is pretty close. Here's one source for $73,486 average: CPS teachers say more than dollars and cents at stake in next contract
    Here's some information that disputes that number and shows that the average salary is $54,000 a year. What you're talking about is an hourly package that includes all the costs.

    City Of Chicago School District 299 Average Teacher Salary & How to Become a Teacher

    Average Teacher Salary in City Of Chicago School District 299

    The average teacher salary in City Of Chicago School District 299 is $54,908.
    “The people do no want virtue; but they are the dupes of pretended patriots” : Elbridge Gerry of Mass; Constitutional Convention 1787

  9. #69
    Sage


    MaggieD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Chicago Area
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    43,243
    Blog Entries
    43

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    And there is the rub. A teacher can only work with the students they are given. In my high school where I taught, we gave all incoming ninth graders a math test to see where they were according to grade level skills so they could take mandated Algebra I. In an average class of 35 kids, the scores ranged all the way from second grade to tenth grade. The distribution was far from even with the average being around fifth grade. The vast vast vast majority of the 35 were not anywhere near grade level in basic arithmetic skills needed to handle Algebra.

    But now the administration says - teach them Algebra... here is your classroom .... here are your books ... here is your paycheck for doing this job.

    What is missing from the recipe?
    And that is exactly the kind of travesty the unions should be addressing . . . if it's really about the children. And we both know it's not. They are merely the pawns used as a means to an end.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

  10. #70
    Sage
    jet57's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    not here
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 07:27 PM
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    24,680

    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Earnings of Educators in Chicago
    In May 2009 the mean annual wage estimate for teachers in Chicago was $62,240, according to Bureau of Labor Statistics. Wage estimates for postsecondary teachers ranged from $40,810 to $102,300. Ironically, postsecondary economics teachers were at the low end of this spectrum. Their counterparts in health specialties occupied the high end. While there were only 260 positions available for economics teachers, there were 390 spots available for health specialties teachers. Elementary, middle and secondary school teachers had a mean annual earnings range between $47,350 and $74,530.

    The mean annual statewide earnings for the teaching profession in Illinois came in at $57,000, according to May 2009 Bureau of Labor Statistics data. This is approximately 10 percent less than that of teachers working in Chicago. Postsecondary teachers had mean annual earnings of between $51,590 and $79,100. Both architecture and health specialties were the highest paying areas statewide. Teachers in elementary, middle and secondary schools had a mean annual earnings range of $45,380 to $67,960.

    The Average Salary of a Teacher in Chicago | eHow.com


    The CTU got its first written contract with the Board of Education in 1966, under the leadership of the late John Desmond:

    His tenure was marked by three-cornered battles waged by the union, the Chicago Board of Education and the Illinois General Assembly over the Chicago school budget. In his six years in office starting salaries for teachers went from $5,500 to $9,570.....snip~

    2010-2011: the CPS gives a starting salary of $50,577 for a first-year teacher with a bachelor's degree. But that's including the seven-percent "pension pickup," which comes from the Board of Education: it's compensation, obviously, but not money teachers get right now.

    Since that doesn't seem to be regularly included in the salaries quoted by news reports, it's probably better for comparison to subtract it, which can easily be done with the more detailed tables provided by CPS (PDF).

    If we do that, the starting salary is $47,628. The maximum, for a teacher with 20 years' experience and a doctorate, is $88,680 ($93,817 if you include the pension pickup). The average, according to the AP, is $69,000.


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Chicago Teacher Salaries: The Long View - The 312 - June 2011 - Chicago


    Hard to believe it began in 1966.
    Ditto char/10

    Here's another; http://www.employmentspot.com/employ...ries-by-state/

    According to CBSalary.com, the average teacher salary by city was as follows:
    •Springfield, IL – $48,015
    •Chicago, IL – $53,713
    •Atlanta, GA – $35,903
    •Savannah, GA – $25,008
    •Orlando, FL – $31,684
    •Tampa, FL – $36,630
    •Miami, FL – $34,501
    “The people do no want virtue; but they are the dupes of pretended patriots” : Elbridge Gerry of Mass; Constitutional Convention 1787

Page 7 of 69 FirstFirst ... 567891757 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •