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Thread: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

  1. #101
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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    What would the feds do if the school district just declared itself bankrupt, filed bankruptcy and shut down all the schools indefinitely? What happens if a school district just declared it doesn't have the $$$ anymore and shut itself down? Would the feds step in? State government? Maybe Chicago could enter into a contract with China to provide education to the kids. Government sells tollways. Why not sell school systems?

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Saw this on CNN. I love the quote from the teachers unions:

    "This is no way to measure the effectiveness of an educator,"
    Then fire every ****ing one of them and replace them with people who believe that there are ways to measure the effectiveness of different educators. (i.e people who are not lying and/or stupid).

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    When I was very active in the union and the Chair of all the high school representing nearly 2,000 members - we constantly pushed for such action only to be told we must limit ourselves to wages, benefits, hours and working conditions for teachers. Everything else was the province of the administration and we were simply told which field we must pick the cotton in.
    -- Betcher' glad you picked that field! Right now, the union is negotiating for air conditioning in every classroom. I'm quite sure their purvue is fairly broad.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    -- Betcher' glad you picked that field! Right now, the union is negotiating for air conditioning in every classroom. I'm quite sure their purvue is fairly broad.
    Except for gym, auto shop and a few other possibilities where there are problems with enclosing, that may be the most reasonable demand they are making if they don't already have it. OMG it gets drenching humid in Chicago in summers.

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Hmmmm so why doesn't the Board of Education and The CTU come up with an Effective means of teaching kids and Implement More Vocational Education
    I would love to see more vocational education implemented!

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    That "horrible evaluation system" has been around for forty years. CPS and teachers collaborated on a new system...the teachers' union is fighting it's "trial implementation" where this year's results would only impact non-tenured teachers and be advisory to tenured ones.
    I'm not sure what system that has been around for forty years that you are talking about. Let me tell you about the merit system that is going to be implemented, from what I know. First of all, teachers are going to grade their own tests. That seems extra stupid to me. Second, I gave the pretest for two classes. In my algebra classes, my students were able to do some of the problems, and do decently well it seemed. The geometry test, however, was full of questions you could only answer if you had taken one year of geometry. There was one question maybe my students could answer. Now, I am required to choose one class period and grade their tests. Guess what class I'm going to choose? My geometry class is going to start with a grade of basically zero, and after I teach them for a year many of them will do much better on the post test. I'm going to look look awesome.

    So at any school all of the geometry teachers are gonna look great almost no matter what, while the algebra teachers, or the algebra II teachers might look worse. It won't mean the geometry teachers are better, its just that the tests are skewed that way.

    This is just one example of how the merit based pay system is messed up. I personally am not against merit pay in and of itself, and neither are my colleagues. However, the devil is in the details. How EXACTLY are teachers going to be judged? At my old school I had many students who would miss one or two classes a week. Am I going to be responsible for my students growth if they don't even make it to class 75% of the time? The number of potential problems is ENORMOUS.

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    Saw this on CNN. I love the quote from the teachers unions:



    Then fire every ****ing one of them and replace them with people who believe that there are ways to measure the effectiveness of different educators. (i.e people who are not lying and/or stupid).
    Do you really think that firing and replacing all of the current teachers would lead to improvement in student achievement?

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by nathanj63 View Post
    Do you really think that firing and replacing all of the current teachers would lead to improvement in student achievement?
    Long-term, sure. Private markets do this day in day out, and it improves overall market performance.

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Quote Originally Posted by nathanj63 View Post
    I'm not sure what system that has been around for forty years that you are talking about. Let me tell you about the merit system that is going to be implemented, from what I know. First of all, teachers are going to grade their own tests. That seems extra stupid to me. Second, I gave the pretest for two classes. In my algebra classes, my students were able to do some of the problems, and do decently well it seemed. The geometry test, however, was full of questions you could only answer if you had taken one year of geometry. There was one question maybe my students could answer. Now, I am required to choose one class period and grade their tests. Guess what class I'm going to choose? My geometry class is going to start with a grade of basically zero, and after I teach them for a year many of them will do much better on the post test. I'm going to look look awesome.

    So at any school all of the geometry teachers are gonna look great almost no matter what, while the algebra teachers, or the algebra II teachers might look worse. It won't mean the geometry teachers are better, its just that the tests are skewed that way.
    The only thing you're missing here is that the committee that put the evaluation together was representative of both sides of the table. They agreed on an evaluation. And now CTU is sitting tight about agreeing to it...on a trial basis. Now. Tell me what sense that makes?

    Rahm Emanuel said there is some system of teacher evaluation in place right now -- totally ineffective -- that's been in place for forty years. If you know something different, post your link.

    This is just one example of how the merit based pay system is messed up. I personally am not against merit pay in and of itself, and neither are my colleagues. However, the devil is in the details. How EXACTLY are teachers going to be judged? At my old school I had many students who would miss one or two classes a week. Am I going to be responsible for my students growth if they don't even make it to class 75% of the time? The number of potential problems is ENORMOUS.
    Pleas post a link on the current (and no longer on the table, btw) merit pay system discussed by the union and CPS. If you have facts, please post them. If you have heresay, you're pickin' up what the union is puttin' down.

    PS -- BTW, I completely agree with you about vocational classes. That kind of thing, imo, is what the teacher's union should be clamoring about. Not art. Not music. ​Vocational Classes!! A program to help these kids, you know, actually earn a living.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Chicago Teachers Strike 2012

    Under their current contract, Chicago teachers earn a minimum of $47,268...if they have less than a year of experience and a bachelor's degree. Plus they get generous benefits and they don't work summers. They're hardly underpaid. They should cut the crap about this being all about the students, when it is clearly all about the teachers. It drives me nuts when highly-educated, upper-middle-class, mostly white teachers advocate for things that actively harm poor, mostly minority students...and then have the audacity as try to frame it as standing up for the little guy.
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