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Thread: Canadian man living in Broward pleads guilty to voting illegally in ‘08 presidential

  1. #211
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    Re: Canadian man living in Broward pleads guilty to voting illegally in ‘08 president

    Quote Originally Posted by sawyerloggingon View Post
    Yet another reason for voter ID laws.

    "Raleigh-based group devoted to reducing the potential for voter fraud presented the N.C. Board of Elections on Friday with a list of nearly 30,000 names of dead people statewide who are still registered to vote."

    The Voter Integrity Project compiled the list after obtaining death records from the state Department of Public Health from 2002 to March 31 and comparing them to the voter rolls.



    NC group finds thousands of deceased people still registered to vote | NBC17.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Article
    The group says it doesn’t know how many of the 30,000 names were actually used to vote illegally, yet.
    Funny how that always seems to pop up in the last paragraph of an article.
    Quote Originally Posted by Article
    The next step is volunteers will match names with voting records.
    Alright, finally someone is listening to me.

    This will be interesting to see if they find anything, in which case there will be headlines everywhere.

    -Or-

    If they find nothing, will that also be reported or will it die in silence, like the allegations that fizzle?
    “We just simply don’t know how to govern” - Rep. Steve Womack (R-AR) a member of the House Budget Committee

  2. #212
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    Re: Canadian man living in Broward pleads guilty to voting illegally in ‘08 president

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    So, are you saying that if it doesn't happen to you it doesn't happen?
    It was an example.

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    Besides, we're talking about non-citizens, so unless you're a non-citizen, their situation would be a little different.
    Legal non-citizens get treated the same in the DMV so whats your point?

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    We're in a court of law now?
    In case you didn't know it but registering to vote just by itself is also illegal if you are not a citizen. Not just voting.

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    Is $300 the financial limit if someone was determined to circumvent the law?

    How about a group discount? LOL!
    I doubt you get group discounts from someone making fake ID's. The point was to show that while fake ID's might be easy to make they are not cheap to get. Which makes them hard to get.

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    Is there an incentive in there somewhere to not give out voter registration cards when you apply for or renew your license? They're post card sized and in a box by the thousands at the clerk's fingertips. It would be more plausible to just give one out to everyone (they can always say "I don't need one thanks") rather than try and circumvent the law using a 'loophole' for no reason whatsoever.
    What incentive is there to give it out? IE They prolly are not given out due to simple lazyness.

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    How do you figure that it's "damn near impossible to catch a person commiting voter fraud"? Haven't various states produced voter registration lists with dead people and/or non-citizens on them? If they have those people identified from the voter registration rolls, that means they have their names, addresses and voter precincts identified. The next step should be obvious and rather simple. Check the actual voter roster at the poll against the list they have already compiled.
    There is a big difference between scouring for registered voters and scouring to see if those people actually voted. The right to privacy prevents one and not the other..can you figure out which one?

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    With the deep pockets of the Koch brothers, and the desire to quash liberals I guarantee that it's been studied and if they had of found something it would've been plastered everywhere
    Not if they feared that it would be used against themselves also. Once someone opens up that can of worms then both sides will be hurt as I'm certain that both sides take advantage of this.

    Quote Originally Posted by BWG View Post
    And further, if it's impossible to catch someone now, how will one know that photo voter ID has or hasn't worked? Or that there has been voter fraud using a fake photo ID?
    In order to get state issued ID for voting you have to show that you are a citizen of the US. A non-citizen could not come up with this proof.

    As for the fake ID you are right..there are those that will use fake ID's and still get away with voter fraud. No system is 100% effective. If it was then there would be no murders, rapes, thefts etc etc. Voter ID's is only one link in a chain to prevent fraud and it should be treated as such. It should never be treated as an end all be all fool proof system.
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    Re: Canadian man living in Broward pleads guilty to voting illegally in ‘08 president

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Tired old talking point. In every case that I have heard about ID laws being voted into law the states have provided a way to get that ID free. Can't exactly use this reasoning when you don't need a single penny to get that ID huh?

    But it costs money to drive to the office to get the ID and time is money too. The ime to wait in line is valuable.

    Even when the ID is free the Democrats find a different reason to oppose it.

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    Re: Canadian man living in Broward pleads guilty to voting illegally in ‘08 president

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang
    Legal non-citizens get treated the same in the DMV so whats your point?
    More paperwork. We were talking about the paperwork shuffle.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang
    In case you didn't know it but registering to vote just by itself is also illegal if you are not a citizen. Not just voting.
    Did anyone say any different? We were talking here, in this forum, about registration, not how it would play out in a court of law.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang
    I doubt you get group discounts from someone making fake ID's. The point was to show that while fake ID's might be easy to make they are not cheap to get. Which makes them hard to get.
    My point was, what would be the financial limit that would deter someone from committing voter fraud.

    The group rate was just a joke towards the conspiracy theory of busing in the number of fraudulent votes it would take to influence an election.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang
    What incentive is there to give it out? IE They prolly are not given out due to simple lazyness.
    I would say that it be more prudent to give them out to everyone rather than risk the allegation of circumventing federal law.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang
    There is a big difference between scouring for registered voters and scouring to see if those people actually voted. The right to privacy prevents one and not the other..can you figure out which one?
    LOL! Well you're going to have to help me out on this one. What is the difference, privacy wise, of a list of registered voters and a list of those who actually voted?

    In fact, you quoted a post (#209) that contained an article where a group in NC plans to do just that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Article
    The group says it doesn’t know how many of the 30,000 names were actually used to vote illegally, yet. The next step is volunteers will match names with voting records.
    I've asked in this thread, and others, why someone hasn't done exactly that before.

    As a supporter of making voting easier and more accessible to all of our citizens, I've noted this article and if the Voter Integrity Project results aren't published in a reasonable time period, I'll ask what happened. I'll be interested in the results, no matter which way they turn out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang
    Not if they feared that it would be used against themselves also.
    I don't think the Koch brothers really care what the liberals, or anyone for that matter, thinks of them. These are the guys whose political actions resulted in the term 'Swift Boating'.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang
    In order to get state issued ID for voting you have to show that you are a citizen of the US. A non-citizen could not come up with this proof.
    Non-citizens can get approved photo ID, legally. That's been established beyond a doubt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang
    As for the fake ID you are right..there are those that will use fake ID's and still get away with voter fraud. No system is 100% effective. If it was then there would be no murders, rapes, thefts etc etc. Voter ID's is only one link in a chain to prevent fraud and it should be treated as such. It should never be treated as an end all be all fool proof system.
    I'm not questioning the effectiveness. There is no problem to combat, so therefore there will be no change.

    One of the voter obstructionists argument is that it's impossible to measure how much voter fraud there is now without photo ID. So my question is - if it's immposible to measure voter fraud now, without photo ID, how will it be possible to measure voter fraud with photo ID laws in place to determine if the photo ID laws are working?

    Or is this going to be a Romney 'Trust Me' moment?
    “We just simply don’t know how to govern” - Rep. Steve Womack (R-AR) a member of the House Budget Committee

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