Page 19 of 23 FirstFirst ... 91718192021 ... LastLast
Results 181 to 190 of 228

Thread: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

  1. #181
    Sage
    Phys251's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Liberal
    Posts
    12,774

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    It's not a hatred of it, most of them are not viable replacements as they stand. When the technologies catch up and perform better sure they'll be accepted but they are woefully inefficient. Couple of things that are problems right now 1) Clean energy has to be subsidized to stay on the market because it doesn't have a large share and for it's costs the return isn't preferable 2) Hybrids have been shown through studies to put out higher levels of pollutants such as lithium dust which can threaten water tables and effect toxin levels in runoff. 3) Hybrids have a lousy return of initial price at the backend due to the price of a new battery and maintenence of the braking systems. 4) It's hard to get a mechanic to work on a hybrid and 5) Electric cars are insufficient for extended travel.
    It was a certainty, as I stated earlier the Volt was originally conceptualized around '07 during the Bush administration and I knew it was a bad idea then. The concept was better than the released version(That's usual) but even the concept was woefully lacking in everything but looks. There's nothing political in my statements against that car but rather I love the GM brand and was concerned that they were gonna eat that turkey.
    Once tech catches up the market will embrace alternatives, till then it is wasteful to subsidize less productive alternatives and economically damaging. I think there is a better way, first I'd like to see magnetic motors be more thouroughly researced, they can theoretically produce the torque and power required to replace FF powerplants, and if done right can have multiple times the range, they are incredibly efficient. As well I would love to see hydrogen tech take off as I think that has great potential, but wind, solar, electrical, and hybrid are just not there.
    I will give deference to the fact that there are still some major cost efficiency hurdles to jump with green energy. That is one of the biggest reasons that it hasn't taken hold.

    The Volt's biggest problem, I think, was that it came on the wrong side of the chicken-and-the-egg dilemma. Increased demand for electric cars would yield more recharging stations, which would increase demand for electric cars. A similar problem likely occurred in the early days of the automobile--gas stations were not nearly as common in days when the majority of people were still traveling by horseback and stagecoach. Nowadays, it's hard to go across town or even the countryside without running into at least a couple of them.

    All that being said, however, to look at this dilemma with a five-year outlook vs. a fifty-year outlook will necessarily yield very different results. Fifty years from now, we are going to have higher seas, we are going to have very expensive gas, we are going to have even more people on this planet than we do now. Green energy isn't just about saving the environment--there is a real, legitimate, long-term economic interest in obtaining them.
    "A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons." --Hillary Rodham Clinton
    "Innocent until proven guilty is for criminal convictions, not elections." --Mitt Romney

  2. #182
    Klattu Verata Nicto
    LaMidRighter's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Louisiana
    Last Seen
    07-21-17 @ 02:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    30,534

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    I will give deference to the fact that there are still some major cost efficiency hurdles to jump with green energy. That is one of the biggest reasons that it hasn't taken hold.
    Okay, but in a lagging economy we have politicians trying to shove a less viable vehicle down people's throats using their own tax dollars to keep it alive. That's a problem.
    The Volt's biggest problem, I think, was that it came on the wrong side of the chicken-and-the-egg dilemma. Increased demand for electric cars would yield more recharging stations, which would increase demand for electric cars. A similar problem likely occurred in the early days of the automobile--gas stations were not nearly as common in days when the majority of people were still traveling by horseback and stagecoach. Nowadays, it's hard to go across town or even the countryside without running into at least a couple of them.
    Actually, the electric car predates the gasoline motor by decades. Yet they still have the same problems.History of Electric Vehicles - Early Years
    Until I can go 200 miles on a five minute charge I won't be interested, and it seems most people tend to gas up on route to other business as well. Very few people want to park a car to pay another electric bill for an hour plus of charging.

    All that being said, however, to look at this dilemma with a five-year outlook vs. a fifty-year outlook will necessarily yield very different results. Fifty years from now, we are going to have higher seas, we are going to have very expensive gas, we are going to have even more people on this planet than we do now. Green energy isn't just about saving the environment--there is a real, legitimate, long-term economic interest in obtaining them.
    I haven't seen any difinitive data to support either stance, but I have seen the economic impacts of failed policy which lasts generations and is hard to get rid of.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  3. #183
    Sage
    Cephus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    CA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 08:54 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    29,793

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    1. It is my understanding that even if recharged on coal-based electricity, electric cars have roughly the same carbon efficiency as the best hybrids.

    2. Find a cost-effective way to switch these electricity sources over to clean renewables, and the above problem is solved as well.
    But they're still not clean energy, they need to be recharged, which is done via dirty means. That might make them cleanER but not clean. And honestly, nuclear is clean, but the same treehugging idiots who want their Prius don't want nuclear power. Go figure.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  4. #184
    Sage
    EagleAye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Last Seen
    03-28-13 @ 09:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    5,697

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Okay, but in a lagging economy we have politicians trying to shove a less viable vehicle down people's throats using their own tax dollars to keep it alive. That's a problem.
    Is anyone really forcing the Volt down your throat? What happens if you refuse? Did he threaten you with prison if you don't buy one? C'mon man. You buy it or you don't. No one is being forced into it.
    Check out my Blog http://momusnews.wordpress.com/
    Sherry's Photography site: http://www.sheywicklundphotos.com/

  5. #185
    Sage
    longview's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:09 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    14,361

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    At the end of the day the volt must compete with every car in it's class, gas, hybrid, and electric.
    Only a small percent would buy one in spite of it's bad pricing, "to do their part for the environment"
    Most people want a car they can afford to buy and drive, that will do the job expected.
    When the functionality and cost/cost of operation of hybrids and electrics, drop below gas vehicles,
    more will be sold. They are close, but still have a bit to go.
    The environmentalist may be part of the problem, as they are willing to pay higher than normal prices
    setting an artificial price floor.
    If the technology had to compete on it's own, it may have been more mature when brought to market.

  6. #186
    Sage
    longview's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 09:09 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    14,361

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    Quote Originally Posted by Phys251 View Post
    Fixed it for you.

    If you can't see that the perception that conservatives hate green energy is alive and well, then we will probably be unable to debate here.
    I can see that your perceptions are alive and well!
    I was suggesting you were painting with too broad of a brush.
    There are plenty of small minded people on both the conservative and liberal sides.
    They are the ones who want to limit peoples freedoms, (In the name of their holy cause of course).
    People buy vehicles within their ability, and based on their needs, a compromise of features.
    If the volt does not fit into the equation (even with the tax credit) it will fail.
    No Hate, no desire, just simple economics.

  7. #187
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Where they have FOX on in bars and restaurants
    Last Seen
    09-14-14 @ 02:09 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    14,700

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    I have nothing against hybrid vehicles and actually I think they have alot of potential and the concept is sound. What I have a problem with is my tax dollars going into a technology that is not yet ripe. When this technology is sound and cost effective people will flock to these cars but until then the government is literally putting the cart ahead of the horse and squandering tax payer dollars that we really can't afford right now.

  8. #188
    Sage

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Last Seen
    Today @ 11:18 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    10,347

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    Quote Originally Posted by EagleAye View Post
    Is anyone really forcing the Volt down your throat? What happens if you refuse? Did he threaten you with prison if you don't buy one? C'mon man. You buy it or you don't. No one is being forced into it.
    While the government is not as yet actually forcing me to buy one, they are getting close. For starters, I am forced through taxes to finance other peoples purchases. I am also forced to purchase corn whiskey to feed my vehicles, and yes, it is shoved down my throat. Forced to use a light bulb I hate, Forced to pay subsidies to windmills I don't want. It's a long list.

    There is a reason I don't purchase a hybrid. I don't want one of the dam things. Nor do I want to pay for those that do. That should be enough reason.

  9. #189
    Klattu Verata Nicto
    LaMidRighter's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Louisiana
    Last Seen
    07-21-17 @ 02:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    30,534

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    Quote Originally Posted by EagleAye View Post
    Is anyone really forcing the Volt down your throat? What happens if you refuse? Did he threaten you with prison if you don't buy one? C'mon man. You buy it or you don't. No one is being forced into it.
    Well, if you bought a Volt there's a 5k subsidy(your tax money back, along with that of others), if you don't people are constantly reminding you that nothing is going to be one about the fuel price problem and you could end up "going broke driving a traditional vehicle". Doesn't sound like people are exactly leaving the issue alone.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  10. #190
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Where I am now
    Last Seen
    09-11-17 @ 03:00 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    16,386

    Re: GM Suspending Chevy Volt Output Due To Slow Sales

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Well, if you bought a Volt there's a 5k subsidy(your tax money back, along with that of others), if you don't people are constantly reminding you that nothing is going to be one about the fuel price problem and you could end up "going broke driving a traditional vehicle". Doesn't sound like people are exactly leaving the issue alone.
    Actually, it's a $7,500 federal tax credit.

    Which I think is especially pathetic on the Volt since the average household income of people who buy one is over $170K per year.

    That means lower and middle income Americans are basically paying richer ones to help them buy a Chevrolet Volt.

    And now that pathetic POTUS Obama wants to raise that to $10K.

    'Obama hikes subsidy to wealthy electric car buyers'

    ...'The new subsidy level represents a 33 percent jump from the current $7,500 government payout for each Volt buyer, even though the Voltís buyers are already among the wealthiest Americans.'...

    Read more: Obama hikes subsidy to wealthy electric car buyers | The Daily Caller

Page 19 of 23 FirstFirst ... 91718192021 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •