"He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
Many cops are extremely bad shots in stress and fast-shoot situations. So if an officer is 50% at the range, if he was 10% in real life it would be lucky. It might because so much attention is paid to other topics, little is left for the physical and danger aspects of being an officer.
The other aspect is there is a big different between shooting at targets and at people/something living - why hunters tend to make good cops in terms of shooting - and why I ALWAYS lead training to situational shooting involving different volunteer people - not just targets. If in practice you shoot lots of people lots of time a person is more prepared for the real thing.
My lady was a champion gymnast and has real physical coordination and abilities. On her request, I trained her on her handgun. She is intense at perfection in anything she does. I used others for situational training and her shooting skill was strictly limited to exact limits and potentials. On one occasion, with paint ball bullets, at a distant of 10 yards and it pre-known what would happen (plus proper eye protection), 4 veteran officers at one end and her at the other were to draw and shoot on command. "On 3. 1, 2, 3!" She "killed" all 4 with head shots firing 4 rounds (her noting they wore bullet resistant vests - "bullet proof" of course a myth). One of them hit her in the leg and he was technically already dead when he did.
Those 4 officers have over 5 decades in law enforcement. They all do ok at the target range. But real life shooting and at moving targets under stress is something quite different - particularly if the target is shooting at them - even if just with paint balls.
And yes, I had her trigger(s) reworked and overall the guns detailed out even before training began. Most manufactured firearms need detailing.
Last edited by joko104; 08-28-12 at 06:25 PM.
If a guy wants to be a cop, he better know how to shoot and how to shoot under pressure. Obviously these cops couldn't shoot under pressure and their biggest problem is that they were using Glocks, one piece of crap that has been known to go off by itself. From what I hear, the cops were only 10 feet from the guy. That's no excuse, since my firearms instructor ( a former combat Marine officer) said that most shootings occur within a zone of 6 yards, or 18 feet to the mathematically challenged. For my ccw, my wife and I had to qualify against a silhouette target at 6 yards, whereas we routinely shoot at small targets 15 and 25 yards away. I make my own targets, small circles that I create from a drawing program in Microsoft Word.
Remember the scene from the Patriot, where Mel Gibson instructed his sons to "aim small, miss small"? That's what I shoot at. From what I hear these cops were lucky to be able hit the broad side of the barn. As a concealed carry holder, I have been taught to practice often and always be aware of where that round is going to go, and if I can't be sure that I won't hit an innocent bystander, then I better not fire or I will be facing serious consequences. Yet, it would appear these cops have been given the okay. I suppose NYPD Police Academy will have a tolerance of 5 collateral damage hits before any disciplinary action will be taken against any future officer.
It is Google - with an upper case G, except in the URL - https://www.google.com/
“And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822
Never said a policeman doesn't need to know how to shoot, did say comparing your old Dude to what cops face is bogus. Please try and follow the line of discussion.
For your CCW class did you engage the target from the CCW holster? When you practice do you run a bit or do a few jumping jacks to get your heart rate up? What course of fire do you use when practicing? Do you and the love of your life practice with airsoft to better simulate a weapon on weapon engagement like cops face?
I ask because PROPER Prior Practice Prevents Piss Poor Performance, it is nice you can stand and hit small targets but if you attend a good defensive pistol course you will see what the stress monkey can do to marksmanship,and movement is a key to surviving a shoot-out, or do you invision the ambush, badguy never sees what hits him sort of thing.
The cops in question should have done better with fewer rounds, but they were getting their cherries popped.
Aim small miss small is very good advice, however there are times when not in a scripted movie where the firstest with the mostest wins, do you know who said that?
I do agree with you on one thing, you have no idea what you will do if a badguy points a weapon at you, how well you will shoot, and if you would do the one round one kill thing.
Oh wait you said another thing I agree with, I am not a Glock fan....
Glocks are great guns. However, the Smith And Wesson MP is a superior design--Far faster to shoot accurately
You seem to think that we ccw holders get that permit so we can go out and kill people. That was not the idea at all. I got it because I can and I could go out and carry open if I wanted because Virginia is an open-carry state. I choose not to because it upsets those northern snowbird transplants from New York, the state where the cops can't shoot without hitting innocent bystanders. I also hope I never have to shoot anyone, but if I have to face someone down, I also know that I could die in the exchange, but what would you do if the life of a loved one depends on you to shoot fast and accurate?
Last edited by bicycleman; 08-29-12 at 05:51 AM.