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Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://www.fo

Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

ChuckBerry said:
Norway gives slaps on the wrists to unrepentant murderers. I wouldn't be so smug if I were you.
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They lock them up to deprive them of their liberty. That's not slap on the wrist.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Indefensibility is in the mind of the beholder.

Jack Fabulous said:
Defending the indefensible is never a good idea.

And I have been to Scandinavia many times. You are GREATLY overstating their quality of life.
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Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Manc Skipper said:
They lock them up to deprive them of their liberty. That's not slap on the wrist.
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When someone murders 77 people, including children, yeah, it is. The warped sense of justice displayed by the Europeans on this board is what is truly shocking.

I agree that the U.S. justice system is flawed, and I am an opponent of capital punishment, but I still believe that horrible crimes should be treated with harsh penalties, up to and including life sentences with no possibility of parole.

I don't see how any reasonable person could think that a person who murders 77 people could, in ten years, cease to be a danger to society. The break from humanity that one has to achieve to do such a thing in my opinion precludes any invitation back in to the fold. He tore up his human card and he threw it away. If he wants to spend his time in prison usefully, he will pray to God (that other thing that Europeans **** on Americans about) that he spares him from the fires of hell ceaselessly day and night. If he dies at age 100, he might have just prayed enough to be spared eternal damnation.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

ChuckBerry said:
When someone murders 77 people, including children, yeah, it is. The warped sense of justice displayed by the Europeans on this board is what is truly shocking.
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Notice how there seems to be a mass shooting in America nearly every week (including one today)? And how random tragedies in countries like Norway are very rare? Even adjusting for population size, they're far more common here than elsewhere. That should probably be a clue that the European sense of justice is more practical than the US sense of justice.

I agree that the U.S. justice system is flawed, and I am an opponent of capital punishment, but I still believe that horrible crimes should be treated with harsh penalties, up to and including life sentences with no possibility of parole.
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He may very well spend the rest of his life in prison. The Norwegian justice system works differently than the American justice system. In the US, once you serve your sentence you are released no matter what. In Norway, you can apparently be held for longer than your sentence if you are still deemed a threat to society.

I don't see how any reasonable person could think that a person who murders 77 people could, in ten years, cease to be a danger to society.
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People change over time. I know I'm not the same person I was 10 years ago. And in any case, if he hasn't ceased to be a danger to society in ten years, then he won't be released in ten years. And no offense, but I'd trust the psychiatrists evaluating him in 10 years to make that decision, more than I'd trust a random unqualified person evaluating him NOW to make that decision.

The break from humanity that one has to achieve to do such a thing in my opinion precludes any invitation back in to the fold. He tore up his human card and he threw it away. If he wants to spend his time in prison usefully, he will pray to God (that other thing that Europeans **** on Americans about) that he spares him from the fires of hell ceaselessly day and night. If he dies at age 100, he might have just prayed enough to be spared eternal damnation.
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If he no longer poses a threat in 10 years, then there is no purpose in continuing to incarcerate him.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Well, my opinion is maybe debatable, but I don't think revenge should have a place in the legal system. Most important, society must be protected from the perpetrator as long as he's still dangerous.

And I don't think an especially long punishment will make much difference. Either a murderer changes his character within the first few years in prison, or he will never change. But I could be wrong.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

ChuckBerry said:
Norway gives slaps on the wrists to unrepentant murderers. I wouldn't be so smug if I were you.
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Me smug HAHA that is a good one. It is you and your fellow conservative Americans that are being critical of the Norwegian legal system just because they dont go around executing left and right. If anyone is smug it is you.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Kandahar said:
In Norway, you can apparently be held for longer than your sentence if you are still deemed a threat to society.
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It is not only in Norway. Most of Scandinavia have the same thing.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

PeteEU said:
It is not only in Norway. Most of Scandinavia have the same thing.
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And I'll wager that, due to their different culture and such, they have FAR fewer criminals per capita, making such a system of individual evaluations FAR more cost effective and accurate, unlike our own. I wonder how many people Norway has had to let go, due to being found out to be completely innocent, years later...
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

The verdict was correct. There is no way this man was any more insane than any other political terrorist.

The sentencing is a sham. I´m not surprised a country that had seven murders a year would have such lax sentencing, but they need to relegislate so an individual like this is punished appropriately in the future. Long story short, this man should be dead.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Don't know how accurate it is, but somewhere I read that up to 4% of the US population are living in prisons. Imagine this drain on the economy, if these numbers are correct. I don't know if European models are suited for America's situation and mentality, but maybe some different kind of dealing with crime is a good idea.

Constant calls for harsher punishments and "law and order" certainly won't solve anything. Deterrence only works so much.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Ben K. said:
The verdict was correct. There is no way this man was any more insane than any other political terrorist.

The sentencing is a sham. I´m not surprised a country that had seven murders a year would have such lax sentencing, but they need to relegislate so an individual like this is punished appropriately in the future. Long story short, this man should be dead.
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Why? They only have 7 murders per year. Seems to me, their system is working a LOT better than our own.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

German guy said:
Don't know how accurate it is, but somewhere I read that up to 4% of the US population are living in prisons. Imagine this drain on the economy, if these numbers are correct. I don't know if European models are suited for America's situation and mentality, but maybe some different kind of dealing with crime is a good idea.

Constant calls for harsher punishments and "law and order" certainly won't solve anything. Deterrence only works so much.
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To some extent, our laws, law enforcement, and justice system, are more responsible for all of our "convicted criminals", than any crimes committed. However, to a larger extent, I have to blame american culture for this. And I think 4% is a low estimation.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

KevinKohler said:
Why? They only have 7 murders per year. Seems to me, their system is working a LOT better than our own.
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Aside from the insane comparison of these two nations, deterrence has no place in my argument. He already killed 77 people, his rehabilitation will bring society no benefit. He destroyed too many peoples lives to be given second chances.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

KevinKohler said:
And I'll wager that, due to their different culture and such, they have FAR fewer criminals per capita, making such a system of individual evaluations FAR more cost effective and accurate, unlike our own. I wonder how many people Norway has had to let go, due to being found out to be completely innocent, years later...
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Crime is all relative. A crime in one country is not a crime in another. Jaywalking is a crime in the US, but not in most of the rest of the world.

The idea behind the evaluation system is a good one. It can prevent unstable people from being released despite having served their term and it has in quite a few cases done so, in both Norway and Denmark and Sweden. It also means that the case is constantly being revisited, and if they do find out .. hey this guy is actually innocent, then they take care of it, which is very different than what happens in the US.

But saying that the sheer volume of people in jail in the US vs random Scandinavian country probably would make an evaluation system near impossible.... In Scandinavia we for one, do not throw people in jail for life for minor drug offences.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Ben K. said:
Aside from the insane comparison of these two nations, deterrence has no place in my argument. He already killed 77 people, his rehabilitation will bring society no benefit. He destroyed too many peoples lives to be given second chances.
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His death will also bring society no benefit... other than revenge, which is not a benefit in a civilized society. As for second chances... after being in jail for 40 to 50 years, and coming out as a 70+ year old.. his "second chances" are pretty much gone.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

The OP missed the parts of the story stating that his semtence could... And most certainly will... Be extended beyond the 21 years if he is considered dangerous. This will effectively be a life sentence, given his ongoing attitude.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Dont know why everyone is getting so worked up over this, the guy will be in prison for the next 21 years and then they will extend his sentence ( he will never leave prison). Couple of friends from Norway were so upset by this that it brought them to tears, this kind of thing just doesnt normally happen in a country like Norway and it was felt throughout the whole country. Too suggest that after 21 years norwegians will just let him go, give him a big hug and say " all is forgiven" shows a lack of respect for Norwegians and their legal system. But hey if by some miracle he is realeased after 21 years you can come back on here and say " I told you so" until then just chill out.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

PeteEU said:
His death will also bring society no benefit... other than revenge, which is not a benefit in a civilized society. As for second chances... after being in jail for 40 to 50 years, and coming out as a 70+ year old.. his "second chances" are pretty much gone.
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That is assuming someone ten to fifty years from now doesn't deem him safe enough to be released.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Sidestreamer said:
The OP missed the parts of the story stating that his semtence could... And most certainly will... Be extended beyond the 21 years if he is considered dangerous. This will effectively be a life sentence, given his ongoing attitude.
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Seeing how we are playing what if, What in ten years from now he claims to have changed his ways and convinced his quacks that he is no longer dangerous? He gets released is what will happen.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

jamesrage said:
Seeing how we are playing what if, What in ten years from now he claims to have changed his ways and convinced his quacks that he is no longer dangerous? He gets released is what will happen.
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no he wont, as I pointed all the pain of this event was felt across the whole of Norway and their is no way he will be allowed out. Again show Norway some respect and let them deal with it in their own way.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Higgins86 said:
no he wont, as I pointed all the pain of this event was felt across the whole of Norway and their is no way he will be allowed out. Again show Norway some respect and let them deal with it in their own way.
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Norway is a country that doesn't give two ****s about the victims.Because Breivik will wise up,tell the quacks what they want to here,claimed to found Jesus or some other deity and all these scumbag sympathizers who are uttering the idiotic line "the justice system shouldn't be about revenge, the justice system shouldn't focus on punishment will argue that Breibik should be released.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

It's the difference between a total corrective approach to crime and punishment, and a retributive model with some sprinkling of corrections on top. As disgusted as I am with Breivik, and as uncomfortable as I am with his relatively (to what I'm used to) sentence, I still would contend that they have a better approach to crime and punishment. That is different than saying that their model is wholly correct, or that it isn't flawed, but I think the mindset is better. We have a natural inclination to seek retribution and 'justice' however we decide to define it for the victims. When it might be better to consider crime and punishment in terms of societal utility, and what approach leads to the greatest utility.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

jamesrage said:
Norway is a country that doesn't give two ****s about the victims.Because Breivik will wise up,tell the quacks what they want to here,claimed to found Jesus or some other deity and all these scumbag sympathizers who are uttering the idiotic line "the justice system shouldn't be about revenge, the justice system shouldn't focus on punishment will argue that Breibik should be released.
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speculation and lets be honest neither of us know anything about Norway's legal system so lets not pretend like we do.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

jamesrage said:
Norway is a country that doesn't give two ****s about the victims.Because Breivik will wise up,tell the quacks what they want to here,claimed to found Jesus or some other deity and all these scumbag sympathizers who are uttering the idiotic line "the justice system shouldn't be about revenge, the justice system shouldn't focus on punishment will argue that Breibik should be released.
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In this thread, like in your comments about gender identity, you prove once again that you have no informed idea about how psychology works. I'll give you a clue - the kind of scenario you're claiming will happen only actually happens in movies​ and the 1980s.
 
Re: Norway court deems Breivik sane, sentences killer to prison Read more: http://ww

Manc Skipper said:
Their society is a lot safer to live in than yours, they must be getting something right. How many mass shootings have they had? How much of their population is locked up? What percentage re-offend? Their penal system works for their society. Yours is plainly dysfunctional.
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I am sure that the 70-80(incarceration rate of 19-101) other countries with similar and lower incarceration rates than Norway don't coddle their inmates.
 
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