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Multiple People Shot Outside Empire State Building

According to a new report the nypd are the ones that wounded everyone.
 
Sounds like maybe cops shooting a suspect in a crowd wasn't such a good judgement call, doesn't it?

The cops did the right thing, better to shoot a few people by accident than be afraid to shoot a nut job that intends to shoot as many people as possible.
 
Sounds like maybe cops shooting a suspect in a crowd wasn't such a good judgement call, doesn't it?

How many lives did they save by taking him out?

Do you realize some were wounded due to fragments?
 
OK, so maybe shooting the perp was the right thing, but the cops who missed need to spend more time on the target range.
 
How many lives did they save by taking him out?

Do you realize some were wounded due to fragments?

They probobly saved there own at least. It doesnt sound like this guy was just shooting people indiscriminately though.
 
They probobly saved there own at least. It doesnt sound like this guy was just shooting people indiscriminately though.

This place was full of people. When you have a whack job aiming at cops or anyone else you have to take him down.

Are there any reports of bystanders being hit directly by the cops' bullets? Did any of them die?
 
This place was full of people. When you have a whack job aiming at cops or anyone else you have to take him down.

Are there any reports of bystanders being hit directly by the cops' bullets? Did any of them die?

Not arguing with you, I would have done the same thing as the cops after reading the story. I was just clarifying that the guy was not just shooting random people. Fact is guns and crowded areas dont mix, the cops did what they had to do.
 
This place was full of people. When you have a whack job aiming at cops or anyone else you have to take him down.

Are there any reports of bystanders being hit directly by the cops' bullets? Did any of them die?

Turns out that the nine people were shot by the police.
 
OK, so maybe shooting the perp was the right thing, but the cops who missed need to spend more time on the target range.

A couple of years ago in Spokane 3 cops shot 21 times at a man with a gun at close range and hit him 3 times. Adrenalin can really screw your aim up. Which brings me to another issue, cops and semi auto pistols. I prefer an old 6 shooter for the very reason that you can't spray bullets. It forces you to take aim and shoot because you know you only have a few rounds. IMO it is a safer gun to shoot in a situation like this NYC thing. Theres a reason full auto is only used for suppressive fire, you can't really hit anything like that. "spray and pray" A bit off subject but it just got me thinking.
 
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Turns out that the nine people were shot by the police.

I understand that but it doesn't sound like any were directly hit and none of them died. I would gladly take a wound if it meant preventing someone else from being killed.
 
the average cop shoots less than 200 rounds a year

the average CCW holder shoots far far more. MOst CCW holders-at least in the classes I taught, were hard core gun enthusiasts who see shooting as their main recreational activity

And for those individuals it is not a concern to me, but for those that put in even less time at the range then a cop, having CCW for protection and having a gun when walking around it should be
 
According to a new report the nypd are the ones that wounded everyone.

I noted that last night after watching the film-I don't believe the shooter engaged the police officers since his weapon jammed
 
I don't think you understand enough of the situation to make such a critique. It's not like they directly hit all 9 bystanders and when you have a maniac swinging a .45 on a busy Friday morning NYC sidewalk you don't have time to wait for everyone to clear zone the shooter.

They were I hope aiming for the target, but missed with a large number of shots and hit 9 people. Any of those 9 could have been killed had the bullet hit them in a different spot.
 
And for those individuals it is not a concern to me, but for those that put in even less time at the range then a cop, having CCW for protection and having a gun when walking around it should be


How many CCW holders do you know (me a couple thousand)
How many have you taught (me a few hundred)
How many shootings have you reviewed (me at least 50 personally-read reports of 200+ more as well)

As noted by the former Cincinnati POlice Department Chief firearms instructor before Cincinnati City counsel several years ago-

take any ten people from Targetworld (the local public range) and compare their gun handling skills and accuracy with any ten officers practicing at the nearby CPD range and the people from TW would win every time
 
How many CCW holders do you know (me a couple thousand)
How many have you taught (me a few hundred)
How many shootings have you reviewed (me at least 50 personally-read reports of 200+ more as well)

As noted by the former Cincinnati POlice Department Chief firearms instructor before Cincinnati City counsel several years ago-

take any ten people from Targetworld (the local public range) and compare their gun handling skills and accuracy with any ten officers practicing at the nearby CPD range and the people from TW would win every time

I was not commenting on the CCW that put in the time like you say at the range, but those that carry without putting in the time, perhaps in response to the number of mass shootings, and a desire to protect themselves when in public
 
I was not commenting on the CCW that put in the time like you say at the range, but those that carry without putting in the time, perhaps in response to the number of mass shootings, and a desire to protect themselves when in public

There are more cops who are crappy shots percentage wise than non LEO CCW holders

8 feet-16 shots and at least 9 rounds that hit others

BRUTAL
 
There are plenty of folks - Bloomberg being first - to softball this situation. In his initial speech he said that some of the wounded might have been shot by the cops. Now we find that ALL of them were shot by cops ... and at exceedingly close range. I'm with the Turtle on this one. There is NO RATIONAL REASON this should happen. I'm not swallowing the stress pablum. This is ice-cold incompetency. And as Freddy Prinz would say, "It's their yob mon". This requires more than a mere hand-slap and saying, "you didn't done good". This is criminal ... and the supervisors who failed to insure proper training need a little jail time for their incompetence as well.

A L
 
A couple of years ago in Spokane 3 cops shot 21 times at a man with a gun at close range and hit him 3 times. Adrenalin can really screw your aim up. Which brings me to another issue, cops and semi auto pistols. I prefer an old 6 shooter for the very reason that you can't spray bullets. It forces you to take aim and shoot because you know you only have a few rounds. IMO it is a safer gun to shoot in a situation like this NYC thing. Theres a reason full auto is only used for suppressive fire, you can't really hit anything like that. "spray and pray" A bit off subject but it just got me thinking.

Spray and pray is just not acceptable in a crowd.

I wonder why cops aren't armed with rifles, at least in some situations? Rifles are a lot more accurate than handguns are.
 
Mighty embarassing to find out that the 9 injured weren't shot by the criminal, but by two of "New York's Finest".... oh my, but that was some really ****ty shooting.


Maybe they need to learn what those bits of metal on top of the gun are for... even under severe stress I could shoot better than that when I was a teenager.

Maybe it has something to do with recruiting cops in a city where almost no one grows up around legally owned firearms...
 
Aww nameless personalities from teh internetz won't pay hollow lip service on a hostile debate forum where no one cares anyway, you poor thing.

I don't consider it hollow lip service. Again, I consider it being a human being. :roll:

Yes, I realize I'm asking the impossible from a guy who is constantly a provocative douchebag on these forums.
 
I was not commenting on the CCW that put in the time like you say at the range, but those that carry without putting in the time, perhaps in response to the number of mass shootings, and a desire to protect themselves when in public

Maybe thats a compromise people.could get behind.

You can carry, but you gotta QUALIFY.

I know theres too many exceptions, like little old ladies, for it to be realistic, but it sure would be nice to weed out the knuckleheads.
 
Maybe thats a compromise people.could get behind.

You can carry, but you gotta QUALIFY.

I know theres too many exceptions, like little old ladies, for it to be realistic, but it sure would be nice to weed out the knuckleheads.


Most states already require you to qualify on the range to recieve a CCW.
 
Most states already require you to qualify on the range to recieve a CCW.

But is it really any kind of test?

Cops qualify but only hit what theyre aiming at like what, 17 percent of the time?
 
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