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Middle-class poorer, earned less in 2000s

I said jobs would come?

you believe unions could have survived without all that New Deal help?

You suggest that unions and such is what is holding them back. Along with tax cuts, a shrinking union has not brough back jobs. So, today, with your POV largely winning, we have less jobs and what jobs we have are lower paying. So, explain how what you support helps? Taxes are low. Unions are shrinking. Jobs are scarce. Please, explain.
 
If they could make a few bucks more and the middleclass wouldnt annihilate them...they would give it a go :)...I bet theres more middleclass marines than rich one percenters :pppppppp

:) and they say class warfare is a scurrilous charge. :)
 
You suggest that unions and such is what is holding them back. Along with tax cuts, a shrinking union has not brough back jobs. So, today, with your POV largely winning, we have less jobs and what jobs we have are lower paying. So, explain how what you support helps? Taxes are low. Unions are shrinking. Jobs are scarce. Please, explain.

the only people taxes are low on are those who demand most of the government
 
:) and they say class warfare is a scurrilous charge. :)

yeah and they get butt hurt when I note envy and bitterness towards the rich is the main stock in trade

I love lefties who keep threatening armed insurrection. I really do

if push comes to shove they will have a new name

casualties:mrgreen:
 
Anyway, as per the subject of the OP, it's worth noting that the biggest income losses have come for those who are near retirement.

...The typical household income for people age 55 to 64 years old is almost 10 percent less in today’s dollars than it was when the recovery officially began three years ago, according to a new report from Sentier Research, a data analysis company that specializes in demographic and income data.

Across the country, in almost every demographic, Americans earn less today than they did in June 2009, when the recovery technically started. As of June, the median household income for all Americans was $50,964, or 4.8 percent lower than its level three years earlier, when the inflation-adjusted median income was $53,508.

The decline looks even worse when comparing today’s incomes to those when the recession began in December 2007. Then, the median household income was $54,916, meaning that incomes have fallen 7.2 percent since the economy last peaked....

economix-23incomechange-blog480-v2.jpg


economix-23incomeagerecovery-blog480.jpg
 
yeah and they get butt hurt when I note envy and bitterness towards the rich is the main stock in trade

I love lefties who keep threatening armed insurrection. I really do

if push comes to shove they will have a new name

casualties:mrgreen:

What I love is that Catawba liked the post. I think the next time he reacts to your charges of class warfare, I shall remind him of that :)
 
Americans are fat, lazy, and spend too much. They need to eat less cheese with their whine, work more without expecting to be paid like a Rockefeller, and save a dime once in a while. They can start by giving up cigarettes, tattoos, and Miller.
 
What?? You think immigrants come over the southern border and immediately join the middle class? Just how cranky are you today, Mr. Hat?

Spare me. The overwhelming majority of illegals immigrants DON'T join the middle class. Pretty hard to do that when you're making less than minimum wage and selling oranges. With that said, for you to even suggest that they play a role in a shrinking middle class is ludicrous. Learn some logic? K thanks.
 
TurtleDude;106082 if you make more than you spend and you can invest the extra what is going to happen?
When it costs more to live when many make, this becomes a little bit hard to do.

do the people who whine about this alleged problem have any valid solutions other than wanting the government to seize more money from the successful?
Yes. Simply put, end government protection of those wealthy. Remove many market entry barriers, so that self employment is more than just a pie in the sky dream, a reality, for the majority of americans. One should not need to hock their future to the tune of 200K plus in order to start their own business. Close tax loopholes. Pretty simple. Make taxes a LOT easier to understand, and fulfill. Remove the need for accountants. Radically alter our current lobbying system, so that laws are not passed that favor one class of people or another. End People's United. One man one vote. Start a public fund for all would be elected reps to campaign on. Basically, remove money from politics as absolutely as much as possible, thereby removing much of the unbalanced influence the wealthy have on our system of governance. Change the FED's mission to simplify monetary policy, thus requiring banks to thrive or fail based on their merrits, and customer service records, rather than get the bailout insurance of the FDIC. In short, I would increase RISK, but also DRASTICALLY increase economic mobility and freedom in this country, and i would radically reduce the use of money in politics, thus removing much of YOUR voice, in order to make it more equal to my own.
 
Ryan will fix this malais with the middle class...He will destroy medicare and give Romney a big TAX CUT...because the rich have gotten fabulously richer while pay half the taxs and they deserve more....and thats why im not a republican anymore folks...

You never were a republican IMHO. Most republicans are fiscally conservative and desire a smaller, less intrusive federal government. Now that you are coming out of the closet, this is where you apologize for acting all butt hurt when I called you a closet liberal right?
 
You never were a republican IMHO. Most republicans are fiscally conservative and desire a smaller, less intrusive federal government. Now that you are coming out of the closet, this is where you apologize for acting all butt hurt when I called you a closet liberal right?

This is such utter nonsense. I guess "most" of those Republicans weren't around from Nixon to Bush II to tell us all about the less intrusive federal government they want banning gay marriage at both FEDERAL and LOCAL levels, doubling debt and feeding the industrial military complex. Yeah, GPS - tell us all about how you're an "Independent" though. I love to hear people bull**** me at the end of the night. It's good to hear people lie to themselves on the internet. :)
 
You never were a republican IMHO. Most republicans are fiscally conservative and desire a smaller, less intrusive federal government. Now that you are coming out of the closet, this is where you apologize for acting all butt hurt when I called you a closet liberal right?

Nah..I dont worry bout what others think...I piss both sides off...I was a long time moderate republican who went registered independent...but I have views that both sides dislike....Im not for gay marriage and Im for gun ownership liberals do not like that...and your aware of some of my views that conservatives dont like...hey im an unlikeable guy and Im ok with that lol...
 
This is such utter nonsense. I guess "most" of those Republicans weren't around from Nixon to Bush II to tell us all about the less intrusive federal government they want banning gay marriage at both FEDERAL and LOCAL levels, doubling debt and feeding the industrial military complex.
Funny, you seem smarter and more educated than this Hatuey. I hate to break it to you but there was no need to “ban” gay marriage from the Nixon to Bush era. Care to take a guess why that is?

The debt comes from liberal social programs that allow the kind of congressional corruption that would put any Wall Street banker in prison. You and Ipast like to whine about corruption in the private sector but there is nothing more fearful or dangerous than corruption of government. This you support and excuse however.


Yeah, GPS - tell us all about how you're an "Independent" though. I love to hear people bull**** me at the end of the night. It's good to hear people lie to themselves on the internet. :)
I grew up a democrat because I had strong emotions about issues but then I became a republican when I started thinking logically and learned to leave emotions out of my decision making process. When republicans, under Bush II, moved further to the left than JFK, I denounced the republican party and went independent. I don’t get to vote in any primaries but that’s ok. I call a spade a spade when I see a spade, unlike some who call a spade a diamond or heart when they really see a spade. It’s all about respecting and valuing truth, logic and reality. You might want to give it a try some time Hatuey.
 
Nah..I dont worry bout what others think...I piss both sides off...I was a long time moderate republican who went registered independent...but I have views that both sides dislike....Im not for gay marriage and Im for gun ownership liberals do not like that...and your aware of some of my views that conservatives dont like...hey im an unlikeable guy and Im ok with that lol...

So you plan to vote for Obama now do you?
 
So you plan to vote for Obama now do you?

Yes i do...and no obama is not my hero nor do I think hes done a good job...but I only have two to choose from...and hes the better of the two for more people as I see it.
 
the only people taxes are low on are those who demand most of the government

Hardly. This is you blind spot. Taxes are lower for everyone, including the rich and business. And for the wealthy, they are lower than they were in our best days as a nation. And despite that, and despite shrinking unions, largely your view of how the world should be, we have struggled for jobs. This suggests your view is simply wrong.
 
The standard of living in the U.S., and our culture, is such that people given the choice, simply do not want to keep cranking on the rat race the way their parents did. Can you blame them?
 
Many spoken of efforts to help. First stop favoring business over working people. Second, take money out of politics so government is less connected to the wealthy. These two alone would be a good start.

First of all get rid of this phrase "working people", because it's commie lingo. You're not going to convince conservatives if you continue to trot out that ****. If the govt didn't have a budget in the trillions (and that doesn't even count the state and local govts), maybe there would be more money in the bank accounts of the middle class. Why is your first solution always busting up businesses? Look at the totally ****ed up tax system we have in this country, we're paying taxes on taxes!! How many times does a citizen need to be taxed on the same money? From federal all the way down to your local township, you're being taxed on the same money you earned in your paycheck, sometimes several times over. How much you want to bet that after all those taxes that you have less than $.50 of every $1.00 you earned?
 
Funny, you seem smarter and more educated than this Hatuey. I hate to break it to you but there was no need to “ban” gay marriage from the Nixon to Bush era. Care to take a guess why that is?

The debt comes from liberal social programs that allow the kind of congressional corruption that would put any Wall Street banker in prison. You and Ipast like to whine about corruption in the private sector but there is nothing more fearful or dangerous than corruption of government. This you support and excuse however.

budget_deficit_or_surplus.gif


Tell us all again how Reagan was a leftist who loved spending. :)
I grew up a democrat because I had strong emotions about issues but then I became a republican when I started thinking logically and learned to leave emotions out of my decision making process. When republicans, under Bush II, moved further to the left than JFK, I denounced the republican party and went independent. I don’t get to vote in any primaries but that’s ok. I call a spade a spade when I see a spade, unlike some who call a spade a diamond or heart when they really see a spade. It’s all about respecting and valuing truth, logic and reality. You might want to give it a try some time Hatuey.

Lmao. Sure you did.
 
First of all get rid of this phrase "working people", because it's commie lingo. You're not going to convince conservatives if you continue to trot out that ****. If the govt didn't have a budget in the trillions (and that doesn't even count the state and local govts), maybe there would be more money in the bank accounts of the middle class. Why is your first solution always busting up businesses? Look at the totally ****ed up tax system we have in this country, we're paying taxes on taxes!! How many times does a citizen need to be taxed on the same money? From federal all the way down to your local township, you're being taxed on the same money you earned in your paycheck, sometimes several times over. How much you want to bet that after all those taxes that you have less than $.50 of every $1.00 you earned?

Nice mindless rant.

The fact remains, tax rates are lower today. Unions are shrinking. This is what conservatives claim will make the economy roar. I've asked for them to explain why their solution isn't working. Care to take a shot at it?
 
Nice mindless rant.

The fact remains, tax rates are lower today. Unions are shrinking. This is what conservatives claim will make the economy roar. I've asked for them to explain why their solution isn't working. Care to take a shot at it?

The govt isn't spending less. What solution are you talking about? There are more little govt fees everywhere than before, so I don't know what you're talking about.
 
if you make more than you spend and you can invest the extra what is going to happen?

do the people who whine about this alleged problem have any valid solutions other than wanting the government to seize more money from the successful?

Most people don't want the goverment to "seize money" from the wealthy, but rather to stop bending over backwards to treat them favorably.
As I recall, TARP funds and stimulous money was given to private companies and wealthy individuals to help "stimulate the economy". Seems like they have one heck of a "welfare" program.
 
The standard of living in the U.S., and our culture, is such that people given the choice, simply do not want to keep cranking on the rat race the way their parents did. Can you blame them?

I really have no clue where you get that impression from. More people are attending college than ever before. More people are studying hard to learn more complex skills to obtain better jobs. More engineers, more journalists, more web designers, more teachers, more chefs, more technical writers, more everything. More people are striving harder than ever before. Job openings are swarmed with applications. And not just the "good" jobs. Minimum wage jobs. Part time jobs at the dollar store. Making sandwiches at Subway. Nurses. Insurance salesman, even! The rat race is on like it has never been.
 
Nice mindless rant.

The fact remains, tax rates are lower today. Unions are shrinking. This is what conservatives claim will make the economy roar. I've asked for them to explain why their solution isn't working. Care to take a shot at it?

You wonder why unions are shrinking, first is because liberals have controlled congress for 6 yrs now. Second liberals controlled all three branches of government for two yrs during this time period. Last liberals kill economic growth, thus 8+% unemployment, a GDP of 1.5%, and an increased 6 trillion added to the national debt under Obama in just 4 yrs. You're right it's not working under Obama and liberal leadership. Further there are more poor under Obama than ever before, the middle class is taking home less in wages under Obama, more people on food stamps than ever before under Obama, the black community unemployment is over 14% under Obama, etc etc Liberalism is not working.
 
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