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Egypt leader Morsi orders army chief Tantawi to resign

kaya'08

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Egyptian President Mohammed Mursi has ordered the retirement of the powerful head of the country's armed forces, Field Marshal Hussein Tantawi, a presidential spokesman has said.


No explanation has so far been given.

President Mursi, who was elected in June, is a member of the Muslim Brotherhood.


Relations between the Brotherhood and the military have been tense since the fall of President Hosni Mubarak last year.



BBC News - Egypt leader Morsi orders army chief Tantawi to resign
 
The situation is a power struggle between the military and the Muslim Brotherhood based on the Turkish model where the secular military was completely sidelined over the years by Turkish fundamentalists. In both cases the military were the real power behind the government and maintained a stable secular outlook despite all their faults.

A further indication of the testing of the Egyptian military's background power, is the fact that Morsi recently was able to replace the independent editors of Egypt most powerful newspapers for Islamists favored by the Brotherhood.
 
The situation is a power struggle between the military and the Muslim Brotherhood based on the Turkish model where the secular military was completely sidelined over the years by Turkish fundamentalists. In both cases the military were the real power behind the government and maintained a stable secular outlook despite all their faults.

And in both cases the military would not have been sidelined in such a way if it did not abuse its powe. Its important that we apply this lessons to our relations with other authoritarian regimes in the region.
 
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And in both cases the military would not have been sidelined in such a way if it did not abuse its powe. Its important that we apply this lessons to our relations with other authoritarian regimes in the region.



Specially in the case of the Egyptian military, there were obviously issues regarding abuse of power, but if you wish to discuss the merits of a secular, tainted government against an Islamic one then it's a matter of opinion. I would chose the military secular option which at least gave Egypt stability for many years and I frankly find it doubtful that the Islamists will be able to improve the country's economic situation.
 
Specially in the case of the Egyptian military, there were obviously issues regarding abuse of power, but if you wish to discuss the merits of a secular, tainted government against an Islamic one then it's a matter of opinion. I would chose the military secular option which at least gave Egypt stability for many years and I frankly find it doubtful that the Islamists will be able to improve the country's economic situation.

They certainly can if they want to

In Turkey, the mildly islamist party currently in power has overseen a strong rise in the Turkish economy, althought the current account deficit is very troubling
 
They certainly can if they want to

In Turkey, the mildly islamist party currently in power has overseen a strong rise in the Turkish economy, althought the current account deficit is very troubling


But the Egyptian economy is inherently weaker than the Turkish one, irrespective of their governments. No doubt the Turkish economy was helped by decades of competitive secular government.
 
But the Egyptian economy is inherently weaker than the Turkish one, irrespective of their governments. No doubt the Turkish economy was helped by decades of competitive secular government.

The Egyptian economy is a fair bit behind that of the Turkish one, but that means quick gains are easier to be made. Egypt has gas reserves, plentiful water if they improved irrigation. If they actuall start to educate the population, they could become a manufacturing base in the region.

If secular governments are reason for economic gains then Egypt should have advanced over the last 30 years rather then stagnate
 
Specially in the case of the Egyptian military, there were obviously issues regarding abuse of power, but if you wish to discuss the merits of a secular, tainted government against an Islamic one then it's a matter of opinion. I would chose the military secular option which at least gave Egypt stability for many years and I frankly find it doubtful that the Islamists will be able to improve the country's economic situation.

Egypt will be Iran in a few years. Except that it seems that Iran may possess a much more educated population.

Let's remember that just after the attacks last week, there were protests against israel in this backward nation, which is stockpiled with billions in American military equipment.
 
The Egyptian economy is a fair bit behind that of the Turkish one, but that means quick gains are easier to be made. Egypt has gas reserves, plentiful water if they improved irrigation. If they actuall start to educate the population, they could become a manufacturing base in the region.

If secular governments are reason for economic gains then Egypt should have advanced over the last 30 years rather then stagnate


We are going in circles here, but to be succinct, the Egyptian economy needs more than a change of government to improve.
 
We are going in circles here, but to be succinct, the Egyptian economy needs more than a change of government to improve.

And I never said otherwise, however the change in government may result in the changes in the economy that will let it grow. Changes that were not going to occur under the old government
 
And I never said otherwise, however the change in government may result in the changes in the economy that will let it grow. Changes that were not going to occur under the old government



... so .... things in Egypt can't go on like this with Mubarak ... and they didn't

they got worse! :roll:
 
... so .... things in Egypt can't go on like this with Mubarak ... and they didn't

they got worse! :roll:

in the short term due to the chaos and uncertainty of the protests of course. That does not mean that in the mid to long term that things will nit get better
 
in the short term due to the chaos and uncertainty of the protests of course. That does not mean that in the mid to long term that things will nit get better

Well like John Keynes said: " The the long term we are all dead".

That being said, it is great to hear your optimism, though not sure what is is based on. Certainly not any facts since the revolution.
 
The Egyptian economy is a fair bit behind that of the Turkish one, but that means quick gains are easier to be made. Egypt has gas reserves, plentiful water if they improved irrigation. If they actuall start to educate the population, they could become a manufacturing base in the region.

If secular governments are reason for economic gains then Egypt should have advanced over the last 30 years rather then stagnate

I have my doubts that anyone representing the Muslim Brotherhood will bother to educate the populace. Smart people have a habit of disagreeing with the MB. Perhaps the military has overstepped it's bounds, but at this juncture I see it as a stabilizing influence. When the government is no longer ruled by radicals, that would be the time for the military to take a back seat.
 
I have my doubts that anyone representing the Muslim Brotherhood will bother to educate the populace. Smart people have a habit of disagreeing with the MB. Perhaps the military has overstepped it's bounds, but at this juncture I see it as a stabilizing influence. When the government is no longer ruled by radicals, that would be the time for the military to take a back seat.

The military is who held power for the last 30 years, it did nothing to improve the economy, it failed to educate the egyptian people, it failed. The current government may or may not be better, but at least now there is an opportunity when there was not one before
 
The military is who held power for the last 30 years, it did nothing to improve the economy, it failed to educate the egyptian people, it failed. The current government may or may not be better, but at least now there is an opportunity when there was not one before

Mubarak held power for the last 30 years. The military just worked for him. When the MB steps in and the first thing they want to do is attack Israel, it tells me straight away that the education and well being of the Egyptian people is very low on their priority list. The LAST thing that Egypt needs now is a war with a foe no one in the middle-east has ever defeated. If Egypt's economy is wrecked, fighting someone who could damage it even further is the last thing Egypt needs. It seems to me, that when Egypt's military refuses to attack Israel, they're the one's thinking with a clear head.
 
Course the Muslim Brotherhood was founded by the middle class, educated men. Education isn't the enemy of the Brotherhood, it has always been the enemy of authoritarian governments, be they the 'gentle hand' of a British protectorate, or a series of militarily backed strongmen. Since 1945 the strongman military cabal has 'lead' Egypt, I can't say they have made educating the masses, expanding the economic base, or been overly peaceful with Israel, well until a series of beat downs and loss of Soviet support left them little choice....

"Independent" editors and peaceful strongmen are very subjective terms I am thinking... :peace
 
This is clearly a tense stance between the political and military sphere. Now that the Muslim Brotherhood has made themselves clear on a few touchy points, such as Israel and US.
Once the Muslim Brotherhood has control of the military, once again Egypt will be under a political vacuum. Let's not also forget the non-Muslims, Coptics’ and Jews that are living in the region...
History reenacts itself and it is funny that we never learn from it... :doh
 
This is clearly a tense stance between the political and military sphere. Now that the Muslim Brotherhood has made themselves clear on a few touchy points, such as Israel and US.
Once the Muslim Brotherhood has control of the military, once again Egypt will be under a political vacuum. Let's not also forget the non-Muslims, Coptics’ and Jews that are living in the region...
History reenacts itself and it is funny that we never learn from it... :doh

Glad you mentioned the Coptics. I have a friend who has relatives in Egypt. He says they all want to leave, but it is not easy.
 
Glad you mentioned the Coptics. I have a friend who has relatives in Egypt. He says they all want to leave, but it is not easy.


That is true... In order to leave Egypt you have to have quite a bit of wealth, a few thousand dollars.
Secondly, if you are a non-Muslim, unfortunately, you are treated second class. This is all based on personal experience!
The major problem is their mentality. In Northern Africa the majority of the population are quite backwards even at the times of the golden age for the Arabs, were much advanced than the Arabs today.
 
Course the Muslim Brotherhood was founded by the middle class, educated men.

New political movements are commonly formed by educated people. At the same time, maintaining control of the followers by the same leaders typically requires blind obedience from "uneducated" followers. The education of the leaders isn't the critical thing, it's the education of the people who follow their bidding that matters.
 
New political movements are commonly formed by educated people. At the same time, maintaining control of the followers by the same leaders typically requires blind obedience from "uneducated" followers. The education of the leaders isn't the critical thing, it's the education of the people who follow their bidding that matters.

Bravo, well said lol...!
 
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