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Leading Israeli religious Zionist rabbi: A woman's place is in the home

This is a cherry-picked non-story, only here because a kook belonging to a specific religion was spouting nonsense. I've seen plenty of the same nonsense spouted by various religious ideologies around the world... and around the corner, for that matter.
 
tecoyah said:
Shouldn't women be "Allowed" to do whatever us Males do?

I seem to remember something....somewhere....that "Allowed for life, liberty. and the pursuit of happiness.
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There appear to be people who disagree with you.

Some religions do not allow women to become official leaders of the flock.
 
CaptainCourtesy said:
An extremist says something stupid. In other news, the sun rose today.
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Extremist? Since when is being a misogynist an extremist position in Judaism, Christianity and Islam? Actually, I'd say it's historically a pretty mainstream position. It's even endorsed, supported and affirmed by their religious books to the agreement of many religious, and their flock leaders, throughout 30 centuries of recorded human history. It became an extremist position to the secular masses when women realized that religion doesn't get to define their place. An extremist? No. This man is a traditionalist much in the way of people today who seek to interpret the Constitution as they believe the Founding Fathers would have.
 
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Hatuey said:
Extremist? Since when is being a misogynist an extremist position in Judaism, Christianity and Islam? .
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The question you SHOULD be asking is what percentage in each religion hold similar views.

In this country, such opinions among Jews are quite rare, as Jews as a whole are more liberal than the average American. There are perhaps a few more fundie Jews in Israel than here, but it is still uncommon enough to be considered well outside the mainstream.
 
Gardener said:
The question you SHOULD be asking is what percentage in each religion hold similar views.

In this country, such opinions among Jews are quite rare, as Jews as a whole are more liberal than the average American. There are perhaps a few more fundie Jews in Israel than here, but it is still uncommon enough to be considered well outside the mainstream.
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You subscribe to spurious accuracy? You know better than to do that. My argument remains. Misogyny is not foreign or extremist concept within Judaeo-Christian or Islamic beliefs. As a matter of fact, they've historically been mainstream amongst these religions.

Wether they're no longer accepted among certain more secular (or for lack of a better word atheistic) segments of society is irrelevant. We could easily take a stroll down the streets of historically Christian/Jewish/Islamic countries and find that there is a religiously grounded marginalization of women across the board regardless of your spurious and irrelevant percentage differences.

Now the discussion which I sought to bring up was that of misogyny within the Abrahamic faiths. You obviously want to push away from that. I guess we are only going to dive into the collective misogyny endorsed by these religions when you can take swipes at Islam and only Islam with immunity?
 
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Hatuey said:
Extremist? Since when is being a misogynist an extremist position in Judaism, Christianity and Islam? Actually, I'd say it's historically a pretty mainstream position. It's even endorsed, supported and affirmed by their religious books to the agreement of many religious, and their flock leaders, throughout 30 centuries of recorded human history. It became an extremist position to the secular masses when women realized that religion doesn't get to define their place. An extremist? No. This man is a traditionalist much in the way of people today who seek to interpret the Constitution as they believe the Founding Fathers would have.
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Of course he's an extremist. Take a cross sample of people from any of those religions and find out what the current mainstream positions are. They won't be similar to what's posted in the OP.
 
CaptainCourtesy said:
Of course he's an extremist. Take a cross sample of people from any of those religions and find out what the current mainstream positions are. They won't be similar to what's posted in the OP.
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Argumentum ad populum? Fallacy. Again, you can't be an "extremist" when you're arguing the historically mainstream understanding of verses found in your religion's books and endorsed by clergy etc. Or are you now going to argue that Judaism, Islam and Christianity, as religions do not see women as being lesser beings? If anything, it is the mainstream understanding of these religions which has become washed out. He's a traditionalist, not an extremist.

PS: If your argument is that if it's not held by a fallaciously invented mainstream it's "extremism", then you may as well start arguing that atheism is an extremist position seeing as how we currently comprise about 7-8% of the populace at best.
 
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johnny_rebson said:
So she thinks women should be allowed to be preachers, ministers, priests, etc.?
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There's already a lot of different sects of Christianity that accept female preachers, including Baptists, Methodists, Anglicans/Episcopalians and Lutherans. I see no reason why not.
 
johnny_rebson said:
There appear to be people who disagree with you.

Some religions do not allow women to become official leaders of the flock.
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Thus my correction to a reply:
"Without religion, people would have no wars. Religion is the only thing that makes us bad."
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Hatuey actually makes the correct assessment in my opinion. I'm not sure why many here are quick to criticize his views on this? Some might even say that a lot of the problems in this world, especially in the western society could go away tomorrow if women were more inclined to stay home and take care of the home. I suppose I'm extree then since my wife has been a stay at home since we met. My kids are better off, our home is spotless and well kept, and my wife and I enjoy each others roles in our family. I have a great deal of respect for her role, and she is equally respectful of mine.

What's so extreme about a women place rteally IS in the home!


Tim-
 
Hicup said:
My kids are better off, our home is spotless and well kept, and my wife and I enjoy each others roles in our family. I have a great deal of respect for her role, and she is equally respectful of mine.

What's so extreme about a women place rteally IS in the home!


Tim-
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Your children are fortunate that their mom actually wants to stay in the home and raise them. Kudos to her.:)

Now that being said, women in general probably don't know how good they had it when men were willing to be the breadwinner, and women were able to stay at home, without it creating a financial strain on the family.

Now that we (women) have been empowered, we have found that we just took on additional responsibilities, in addition to those we already had- it's a tough job running the world. :2razz:
 
Hicup said:
Hatuey actually makes the correct assessment in my opinion. I'm not sure why many here are quick to criticize his views on this? Some might even say that a lot of the problems in this world, especially in the western society could go away tomorrow if women were more inclined to stay home and take care of the home. I suppose I'm extree then since my wife has been a stay at home since we met. My kids are better off, our home is spotless and well kept, and my wife and I enjoy each others roles in our family. I have a great deal of respect for her role, and she is equally respectful of mine.

What's so extreme about a women place rteally IS in the home!


Tim-
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Wow, you should be part of the Taliban, you share the same views about women. And for the record forcing someone to stay home is not respect.
 
TheNextEra said:
Wow, you should be part of the Taliban, you share the same views about women. And for the record forcing someone to stay home is not respect.
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How did you get forcing from my post? Lizzie had it right, perhaps she took better advantage of her education than you?

That said, I am a FIRM believer that someone needs to be home, where home is the routine, not the place where parents go to eat dinner and sleep.


Tim-
 
It's intriguing how frequently religious extremists tend to want to oppress women, regardless of which religion they're extreme about.
 
TheNextEra said:
Wow, you should be part of the Taliban, you share the same views about women. And for the record forcing someone to stay home is not respect.
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I didn't see anything about force being used.
 
Hicup said:
Hatuey actually makes the correct assessment in my opinion. I'm not sure why many here are quick to criticize his views on this? Some might even say that a lot of the problems in this world, especially in the western society could go away tomorrow if women were more inclined to stay home and take care of the home. I suppose I'm extree then since my wife has been a stay at home since we met. My kids are better off, our home is spotless and well kept, and my wife and I enjoy each others roles in our family. I have a great deal of respect for her role, and she is equally respectful of mine.

What's so extreme about a women place rteally IS in the home!


Tim-
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I'm not arguing that his position isn't extreme within a wider societal construct that takes into consideration secular opinions. I'm arguing that within the historical understanding and teachings of Abrahamic faith, his position is perfectly well within the mainstream.
 
Hatuey said:
I'm not arguing that his position isn't extreme within a wider societal construct that takes into consideration secular opinions. I'm arguing that within the historical understanding and teachings of Abrahamic faith, his position is perfectly well within the mainstream.
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I think a better term, and one more widely used to describe such people, is "fundamentalist"
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
I think a better term, and one more widely used to describe such people, is "fundamentalist"
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No, no, he is a traditionalist as well as fundamentalist. His belief in fundamentals are part of a tradition.
 
Mickey Shane said:
That is correct.
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But if religious leaders think that women lack the necessities to be effective religious leaders, who are you to tell them they're wrong? What is your recourse?
 
Hatuey said:
No, no, he is a traditionalist as well as fundamentalist. His belief in fundamentals are part of a tradition.
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what would be the difference between the two?
 
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