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Thread: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Cars and alcohol don't kill people, either, but we restrict possession and use of them, too. It would be really nice if we could have an intelligent conversation over gun control, rather than reactionary ones where proponents of gun ownership rely on slogans to diffuse the discussion itself. There is no popular movement for mass disarmament, only reasonable restrictions, specifically to prevent violent incidents. The right and ability to protect oneself or one's home are not on the chopping block. Nor is the ability of citizens to keep weapons as a caution against tyranny. The issue is safety, and whether a little bit of regulation could go a long way to keeping us safe from violence. Not a lot of regulation going a little way. That would be unconstitutional. But the discussion must take place. The facts must be evaluated. If it turns out that restricting guns won't make us safer, than we shouldn't restrict them. But we at least have to address the issue in a rational manner, not with outrage.




    The difference, obviously, is that knives have a purpose beyond violence. Guns do not. They are weapons, with no use other than killing. This is an important distinction that makes evaluating guns different from evaluating other things. Crossbows, for example, have no use other than as weaponry. Baseball bats do. See the difference?
    Just not true and you know it. A gun is a tool nothing more. It has no intent or malice, it is a hunk of steel with some plastic thrown in.

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Cars and alcohol don't kill people, either, but we restrict possession and use of them, too. It would be really nice if we could have an intelligent conversation over gun control, rather than reactionary ones where proponents of gun ownership rely on slogans to diffuse the discussion itself. There is no popular movement for mass disarmament, only reasonable restrictions, specifically to prevent violent incidents. The right and ability to protect oneself or one's home are not on the chopping block. Nor is the ability of citizens to keep weapons as a caution against tyranny. The issue is safety, and whether a little bit of regulation could go a long way to keeping us safe from violence. Not a lot of regulation going a little way. That would be unconstitutional. But the discussion must take place. The facts must be evaluated. If it turns out that restricting guns won't make us safer, than we shouldn't restrict them. But we at least have to address the issue in a rational manner, not with outrage.




    The difference, obviously, is that knives have a purpose beyond violence. Guns do not. They are weapons, with no use other than killing. This is an important distinction that makes evaluating guns different from evaluating other things. Crossbows, for example, have no use other than as weaponry. Baseball bats do. See the difference?

    the difference between guns and other potentially dangerous objects is that in the latter case-only laws preventing misuse generally exist. No one wants to ban cars that can go 120 MPH, just driving that fast on a public road. no one wants to ban alcohol (well there might be a few kooks who didn't learn history)-we just ban being intoxicated in public

    yet the anti gun nut cases want to ban some types of guns

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by mtlhdtodd View Post
    Just not true and you know it. A gun is a tool nothing more. It has no intent or malice, it is a hunk of steel with some plastic thrown in.
    people who don't shoot and have no clue about guns tend to make ignorant statements about the various uses of guns

    right now there are a ton of athletes in London with firearms and NONE of those guns are designed to kill anything or anyone

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    Always playing the victim. This time you're the victim of the liberal media not giving stories which support our politics enough attention.
    The media claims to be unbiased.Running guns are evil stories while deliberately ignoring gun save lives stories is blatantly biased. Especially when you have various people injecting commentary how we need more anti-gun laws in those those guns are evil stories.


    And lastly, well done on the part of that man it shows what responsible gun ownership is all about.
    Personally I think he should have shot the guy.It would have saved tax payers money and ensured that the victims do not have to go through any more grief than what they already have.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The media claims to be unbiased.Running guns are evil stories while deliberately ignoring gun save lives stories is blatantly biased. Especially when you have various people injecting commentary how we need more anti-gun laws in those those guns are evil stories.




    Personally I think he should have shot the guy.It would have saved tax payers money and ensured that the victims do not have to go through any more grief than what they already have.
    Really? This is not the statement of a responsible gun owner.
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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    The media claims to be unbiased.Running guns are evil stories while deliberately ignoring gun save lives stories is blatantly biased. Especially when you have various people injecting commentary how we need more anti-gun laws in those those guns are evil stories.

    Personally I think he should have shot the guy.It would have saved tax payers money and ensured that the victims do not have to go through any more grief than what they already have.
    I would love to see some actual information to that point instead of just your anecdote, and while you're at it keep in mind that when it comes to things like television media that ratings drive profit by affecting how much they can sell their advertising space for. And when you're thinking about that, think what kind of stories people naturally want to hear about and keep coming back to hear more about. Is it "Man pulls gun, saves two lives, suspect arrested" or "Man pulls gun, fires into crowd, killing several?" People naturally want to hear more about villains than heroes.

    And that is not a statement of a responsible gun owner, being a gun owner doesn't give one the right to make those kind of decisions. Unless you act to defend yourself or the lives of others, there is no place to use deadly force and a responsible gun owner knows this and doesn't seek excuses to kill someone like saving tax payer money or deciding the victims would prefer it, who are you to speak for them?

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaddelamancha View Post
    Really? This is not the statement of a responsible gun owner.

    I would disagree somewhat. A knife is a deadly weapon every bit as much as a gun; a knife can kill very readily. When I was in LE we had many training sessions about knives, mainly to teach us to take them very seriously. A man can run 25 feet and stab you in the time it takes to draw a pistol and shoot him. Stab wounds are often fatal.

    The man had already cut or stabbed more than one person; he had already committed Attempted Murder. Shooting him is a reasonable response; he is fortunate that the armed citizen who stopped his rampage before it reached "national news body count level" desired not to kill him if it could be avoided. Had he pulled the trigger without warning it would have been a justifiable shoot no question.

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    Always playing the victim. This time you're the victim of the liberal media not giving stories which support our politics enough attention.
    I don't recall the last time I have seen such a story told on the national news. Or in any sort of news special that is national.
    "nah i think the way cons want to turn this into a political issue is funny though" - Philly Boss

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Cars and alcohol don't kill people, either, but we restrict possession and use of them, too. It would be really nice if we could have an intelligent conversation over gun control, rather than reactionary ones where proponents of gun ownership rely on slogans to diffuse the discussion itself. There is no popular movement for mass disarmament, only reasonable restrictions, specifically to prevent violent incidents. The right and ability to protect oneself or one's home are not on the chopping block. Nor is the ability of citizens to keep weapons as a caution against tyranny. The issue is safety, and whether a little bit of regulation could go a long way to keeping us safe from violence. Not a lot of regulation going a little way. That would be unconstitutional. But the discussion must take place. The facts must be evaluated. If it turns out that restricting guns won't make us safer, than we shouldn't restrict them. But we at least have to address the issue in a rational manner, not with outrage.




    The difference, obviously, is that knives have a purpose beyond violence. Guns do not. They are weapons, with no use other than killing. This is an important distinction that makes evaluating guns different from evaluating other things. Crossbows, for example, have no use other than as weaponry. Baseball bats do. See the difference?
    The great, glittering generality of "reasonable restrictions" AGAIN, of course, without actually defining those "reasonable restrictions" AT ALL. You should get the Haymarket, or Boo award for (re)stating the obvious without saying anything SPECIFIC at all. Interesting that you added "If it turns out that restricting guns won't make us safer, than [sic] we shouldn't restrict them", as that means the AWB, CCW permits and near total bans as used in Chicago and DC can be scrapped since crime did NOT go down after passing those laws. What is USUALLY said, is that MORE gun control is needed since what we have now is OBVIOUSLY not "yet" enough, since we still have SOME gun crime left.

    Can you define what these mysterious "reasonable restrictions" actually are? How much they will cost the "reasonable" and law abiding gun owner in both money and possible time in prison? For example Texas has decided that to carry a handgun in a car is LEGAL WITHOUT A CCW PERMIT yet to carry on the person is NOT. In other words, a driver's license is a partial CCW permit but requires NO training or fee, but if one does not drive then they must travel UNARMED or pay $240 for a CCW permit.
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 07-27-12 at 08:34 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Gun carrying man ends stabbing spree at grocery store

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    The great, glittering generality of "reasonable restrictions" AGAIN, of course, without actually defining those "reasonable restrictions" AT ALL. You should get the Haymarket, or Boo award for (re)stating the obvious without saying anything SPECIFIC at all. Interesting that you added "If it turns out that restricting guns won't make us safer, than [sic] we shouldn't restrict them", as that means the AWB, CCW permits and near total bans as used in Chicago and DC can be scrapped since crime did NOT go down after passing those laws. What is USUALLY said, is that MORE gun control is needed since what we have now is OBVIOUSLY not "yet" enough, since we still have SOME gun crime left.

    Can you define what these mysterious "reasonable restrictions" actually are? How much they will cost the "reasonable" and law abiding gun owner in both money and possible time in prison? For example Texas has decided that to carry a handgun in a car is LEGAL WITHOUT A CCW PERMIT yet to carry on the person is NOT. In other words, a driver's license is a partial CCW permit but requires NO training or fee, but if one does not drive then they must travel UNARMED or pay $240 for a CCW permit.
    And of course, these types love to talk about things like "national conversations," as though such a thing is even possible. More likely what they really mean is "get everyone to come around to my way of thinking," 'coz I really doubt if any "national conversation" took place, and it came out differently from what they wanted, they'd say "OK, that's that."
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

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