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Thread: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    I would disagree, but have the tact and common courtesy to not deem them stupid.
    Tact and common courtesy only factor into to what you say about people out loud. Calling them stupid to their face would be tactless. Recognizing that someone is stupid is just recognizing facts. Not all facts are rainbows.

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Please quote me where I said that it is not alright for a business owner to not support gay marriage. Apparently, you have access to a part of my brain that has lost its internet service. Upon seeing your quote, I'll apologize for ever doubting you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    With respect, I already stated why I did not answer your comments...



    ...because you have already made it clear that it's not alright for a business owner to not support gay marriage. Not liking to waste time with truly unfair notions, I'm not going to answer that comment. In my opinion I think all business owners ought to have their non-violent opinions without fear of punishment. You seem to disagree with this.

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Yeah... and the New Black Panther Movement just wants to help white people find the error of their ways. Do you know how ridiculous and condescending you sound when you argue that you have the power to help gay people get fixed? Does your brain even program such information? I mean I get it. But could you imagine the little fit you and other Christians would have if an Atheist group had a camp designed to turn Christians into atheists because they thought their lifestyle - and yes - Christian IS a lifestyle you choose - was wrong?
    Would an atheist camp devoted to helping Christian kids shed their illogical fantasies about the sky fairy be a hate group? No, just an ignorant group. If their mission was "eradicate the Christians, Christians are evil and we hate them" then they would be a hate group. Christianity is a lifestyle choice, people can disagree with it and they do. People can mock it, try to change people from it and disrespect it (as is frequently done) but that isn't an action of hate against Christian individuals.
    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. -Socrates
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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    The KKK and NeoNazis hate minorities and Jews. The FRC condemns homosexual acts and believes that homosexual behavior is unhealthy and damaging to the individual. You can disagree with their studies, but I see no evidence that they hate homosexual individuals and on their website they say that sympathy should be shown and that homosexuals should be helped out of that lifestyle. You can certainly strongly disagree with them, but this isn't an issue of hate nor can they be rationally compared to the KKK or NeoNazis. It's not rational to call them a hate group and I largely suspect they are branded as such because people impose their irrational bias and their desire to believe that FRC is a hate group because it's fueled by their illogical and unfair desire to "demonize the enemy." The Wesboro morons are a hate group, the FRC is not.
    Wow, you are defending a hate group. I bet you are making your great grandchildren proud. This group's "research" is cherry picked literature reviews that seek to make gays look like public health enemy number one. I bet if you go to the KKK's website you could tell me how they are an honest organization seeking to protect the heritage of white Americans and have no hatred for blacks, but merely wish to escort them back to Africa. Seriously dude, you are embarrassing yourself.

    You could also address my original question though. Would you support city governments legally banning Target stores solely because Target supports SSM and sells pro-homosexual merchandise and the city's argument is that "Target does not reflect our values"?
    Um...why is the question even relevant? An organization supporting same sex marriage is not the same as an organization supporting a hate group. That is the way I see it. Get over the whole idea that I have to see it your way. The FRC is a hate group, just as surely as the KKK is. As that is my perspective, you will have to accept that I see your perspective as ludicrous.
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    The economy will improve under this bill. If a few people die, it will be for the betterament of this country.

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    The KKK and NeoNazis hate minorities and Jews. The FRC condemns homosexual acts and believes that homosexual behavior is unhealthy and damaging to the individual. You can disagree with their studies, but I see no evidence that they hate homosexual individuals and on their website they say that sympathy should be shown and that homosexuals should be helped out of that lifestyle. You can certainly strongly disagree with them, but this isn't an issue of hate nor can they be rationally compared to the KKK or NeoNazis. It's not rational to call them a hate group and I largely suspect they are branded as such because people impose their irrational bias and their desire to believe that FRC is a hate group because it's fueled by their illogical and unfair desire to "demonize the enemy." The Wesboro morons are a hate group, the FRC is not.
    It's interesting that you've spent the better part of this thread attempting to show that people's viewpoints are inconsistent (and therefore, problematic) if they support banning anti-SSM groups but not pro-SSM groups. However, you are displaying exactly what you are trying to fight against: inconsistency. The KKK and NeoNazis more often than not in modern times do not argue that they "hate" blacks or Jews. On the contrary, they tend to despise such attacks on their character and only claim that they want "racial separatism" or even to help minorities embrace their own culture. It's all bull****.

    You're blinded by your own bias on this issue.

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Would an atheist camp devoted to helping Christian kids shed their illogical fantasies about the sky fairy be a hate group?
    That doesn't even make sense. Try rewriting it.

    No, just an ignorant group. If their mission was "eradicate the Christians, Christians are evil and we hate them" then they would be a hate group. Christianity is a lifestyle choice, people can disagree with it and they do. People can mock it, try to change people from it and disrespect it (as is frequently done) but that isn't an action of hate against Christian individuals.
    Here. I'll copy that exact paragraph and replace the key words:

    No, just an ignorant group. If their mission was "eradicate homosexuality, homosexuality is evil and we hate it" then they would be a hate group.
    Now answer honestly: Is this not the view the Christian right has of homosexuality? If you answer no - you're being dishonest.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    The problem is that you are on one side of the same coin. The beauty of reality is that it is complex, no truths are written in stone, and there will exist groups of people who have differing opinions. You proclaim your opinion is the truth. You cannot know, because it is your opinion. You and your beliefs, the owner of Chick-fil-A and his views... can coexist. Does this business refuse to hire homosexuals? I doubt it. And yes, there do exist certain ideologues with opinions, gasp, that are different than yours that donate their money to groups that share the same views. Let it be. I acknowledge that there are those who donate money towards organizations that have views that oppose mine, but I let it be and accept it, because I'm not so arrogant as to demand others can't have their views, or donate money to them. It's arrogance.
    Ah! You want to play the relativism card! I love that card! But I learned an amazing way to win when that card is played from none other than a Christian missionary! When you have two equally possible alternatives you go with the one that errs on the side of not hurting people. Let's compare...organizations that support people forming committed long term relationships or organizations that support lies and distortions about an entire group of people...hm....I wonder which one might be hurting people!
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    The economy will improve under this bill. If a few people die, it will be for the betterament of this country.

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    This is just Chicago being stupid. It's discriminatory to punish a business because the owner disagrees with gay marriage. It would be like cities banning Target for supporting them. It hurts business owners and is wrong.
    I respond:

    Walt Disney
    American girl
    Ford
    McDonalds
    Hallmark cards
    Campbell soup company
    Archie Comics
    JC Penny
    Starbucks
    Home Depot
    Pepsi
    MillerCoors

    They are boycotted or have been boycotted, campaigned against because they support gay and lesbian causes. The liberals will stop their fight right after the religious right stops their boycotts and campaigns.
    Former military man (and now babysitter of Donald Trump) John Kelly, is a big loud lying empty barrel!

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    I respond:

    Walt Disney
    American girl
    Ford
    McDonalds
    Hallmark cards
    Campbell soup company
    Archie Comics
    JC Penny
    Starbucks
    Home Depot
    Pepsi
    MillerCoors

    They are boycotted or have been boycotted, campaigned against because they support gay and lesbian causes. The liberals will stop their fight right after the religious right stops their boycotts and campaigns.
    You should add Oreos. Christians hate that.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    re: Rahm: “Chick-fil-A Values Are Not Chicago Values” [W:698]

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Wow, you are defending a hate group. I bet you are making your great grandchildren proud. This group's "research" is cherry picked literature reviews that seek to make gays look like public health enemy number one. I bet if you go to the KKK's website you could tell me how they are an honest organization seeking to protect the heritage of white Americans and have no hatred for blacks, but merely wish to escort them back to Africa. Seriously dude, you are embarrassing yourself.
    the KKK literally hates minorities though, this is what you are failing to comprehend. Historic acts of violence by the KKK is evidence. Show me the acts of violates against gay people directly committed by the FRC and supported by them. Personally, what I find embarrassing is trying to honestly compare FRC with the KKK and NeoNazis.
    Um...why is the question even relevant? An organization supporting same sex marriage is not the same as an organization supporting a hate group. That is the way I see it. Get over the whole idea that I have to see it your way. The FRC is a hate group, just as surely as the KKK is. As that is my perspective, you will have to accept that I see your perspective as ludicrous.
    You can loosely define anything as a hate group based on your own bias and need to label them as such, but either way it's not rational. And the question is relevant, because that's the grounds that the cities want to use to ban Chick Fil A, not because Chick Fil A donates to "hate groups." On a legal level this is what they are arguing, which would also mean that other cities should be allowed to ban companies that happen to support SSM solely based on the owner's values and beliefs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    I respond:

    Walt Disney
    American girl
    Ford
    McDonalds
    Hallmark cards
    Campbell soup company
    Archie Comics
    JC Penny
    Starbucks
    Home Depot
    Pepsi
    MillerCoors

    They are boycotted or have been boycotted, campaigned against because they support gay and lesbian causes. The liberals will stop their fight right after the religious right stops their boycotts and campaigns.
    And as I've said, people have every right to boycott and give their business to establishments that respect their personal values. What isn't right is for governments to try and use the law to keep businesses out that do not agree with their values.


    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    It's interesting that you've spent the better part of this thread attempting to show that people's viewpoints are inconsistent (and therefore, problematic) if they support banning anti-SSM groups but not pro-SSM groups. However, you are displaying exactly what you are trying to fight against: inconsistency. The KKK and NeoNazis more often than not in modern times do not argue that they "hate" blacks or Jews. On the contrary, they tend to despise such attacks on their character and only claim that they want "racial separatism" or even to help minorities embrace their own culture. It's all bull****.

    You're blinded by your own bias on this issue.
    As I've referenced, the KKK and certainly the Nazis were violent. Their ideals were based on hate. If I'm not mistaken the KKK supports that there is a superior race and that others are inferior (as well as the Nazis). They can't be compared to FRC, which throws out research that is conducted in bias that happens to not support the homosexual rights movement. I think the blind bias comes in when people chose to irrationally label the FRC as a hate group and compare them to the KKK because they can't separate their personal dislike for them from rational argumentation. It's part of a partisan mindset, people who act irrationally on an issue want to believe that the "other side" is evil or hateful. It happens all the time.
    Last edited by digsbe; 07-25-12 at 09:17 PM.
    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. -Socrates
    Tired of elections being between the lesser of two evils.

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