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Thread: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Has anyone stopped to calculate the odds of being killed by a deranged gunman as opposed to, say for example, being killed by some idiot who is texting and driving, or who likes to drink and drive?

    It seems to me that the reason this is being made into such a big deal is not just the senselessness of it, or the loss of innocent life, as it is the rarity of such a thing happening.
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Has anyone stopped to calculate the odds of being killed by a deranged gunman as opposed to, say for example, being killed by some idiot who is texting and driving, or who likes to drink and drive?

    It seems to me that the reason this is being made into such a big deal is not just the senselessness of it, or the loss of innocent life, as it is the rarity of such a thing happening.
    I think rarity is definitely a part of it, another part is the sensationalism of it, text driving accidents are localized and expected so they don't register a blip, but when a pyschopath plans out wholesale slaughter of innocents it has a shock effect that boosts ratings. It's kind of a national version of rubbernecking at a gruesome accident.
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Has anyone stopped to calculate the odds of being killed by a deranged gunman as opposed to, say for example, being killed by some idiot who is texting and driving, or who likes to drink and drive?

    It seems to me that the reason this is being made into such a big deal is not just the senselessness of it, or the loss of innocent life, as it is the rarity of such a thing happening.
    I'd agree completely. I think it's the "unexpected factor." We expect people to die from drinking and driving / texting and driving. We don't expect to walk into a movie theatre and watch a crowd of people get shot. It just seems a bit hypocritical to me.
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Yeah, same with Laughner, both cases there were red flags not reported before they engaged in violence. The system is only as good as the record and reporting, if police think someone is a danger they MUST flag them, otherwise there are no further tools to go off of.
    Perhaps we could have a system where preventitive measures could serve as well.

    Example say I live downtown D.C. and I walk into a store and say I'd like 5 sticks of dynamite any questions?

    This kid bought 3 guns and a **** load of ammunition and he lives in Denver ?
    What at 20 he decided to be a gun collector and bought the ammunition to look at?

    Maybe he had big rats, or maybe he needed protection?
    Or maybe just maybe some gun dealer was too busy counting money to ask.
    Did he ask for a red gun to match his hair?
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Has anyone stopped to calculate the odds of being killed by a deranged gunman as opposed to, say for example, being killed by some idiot who is texting and driving, or who likes to drink and drive?

    It seems to me that the reason this is being made into such a big deal is not just the senselessness of it, or the loss of innocent life, as it is the rarity of such a thing happening.
    12 DEAD, 58 WOUNDED FOR WATCHING A MOVIE?
    I'd call that a big deal.
    Has Americans came so far that instead of making gun owners uncomfortable or gun organizations feel bad , we just count Americans dieing as an acceptable loss?

    This happens every time some say "doesn't happen that often " "next time it will be less."?

    Kinda like letting the cows out and then saying "I'll get the door"?
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Has anyone stopped to calculate the odds of being killed by a deranged gunman as opposed to, say for example, being killed by some idiot who is texting and driving, or who likes to drink and drive?

    It seems to me that the reason this is being made into such a big deal is not just the senselessness of it, or the loss of innocent life, as it is the rarity of such a thing happening.
    I think the odds are somewhere around 1 in 300 million. But in Colorado the odds seem to be far greater.

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Bull****. I can get a gun within a few hours illegally if I wanted to without setting foot in a gun show. If people want to use a gun for murder, as was the case here, they'll find a way to get the gun somehow. It's just like drugs. People find em, and no matter how many laws are thrown into the mix, they keep finding them.
    I completely agree that guns, just like drugs, can be obtained as long as somebody is willing to do what it takes to get what they want. However, do you think that since drugs can be obtained by anybody who wants them, it should be legal to buy heroin over the internet and have it shipped straight to your house? Just legalize crack since people are going to find a way to get it if they're determined enough? I think there should be much less regulation than there is now with regard to certain substances, ranging from synthetic marijuana to hallucinogenic drugs that could be useful in clinical settings. But I sure as hell don't think you should be able to order heroin online.

    My point is that while I agree with what you said, that doesn't mean that all guns should be legal to purchase by anyone who doesn't have a felony (or have a felony yet). It makes no sense that weapon Holmes used in this shooting was legal for him to purchase, and it makes no sense that we have no system that can trigger red flags when a person suddenly spends thousands of dollars on firearms and ammunition. I'm not saying that gun control would have prevented this tragedy, but I do think that we need to have a system in place to ensure that gun sales are tightly regulated and anybody who chooses to own multiple guns goes through proper training and is using and storing their weapons safely.

    I've seen a lot of responses from people against gun control because they use "semi-automatic" weapons for competitive shooting events and "hunting varmint." Fine, keep your guns, shoot squirrels and make your squirrel pie. But to have those kind of weapons, you should be properly vetted in order to prevent psychotic murderers from being able to obtain the weapons for a mass killing without breaking a single law. When you buy sudafed you have to show your ID and there are red flags when it looks like a person could be manufacturing methamphetamine. That's fine, but it's not ok to track people who have in their possession weapons that can kill hundreds of people? From what I've heard, Holmes had never owned a gun before and over a few months, he had thousands of rounds of ammunition and a semi-automatic rifle. I don't care how much you love squirrel pie, you should not be able to legally do that without any oversight whatsoever.

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Yeah, same with Laughner, both cases there were red flags not reported before they engaged in violence. The system is only as good as the record and reporting, if police think someone is a danger they MUST flag them, otherwise there are no further tools to go off of.
    Problem is, though, in shall-issue states, there's nothing that anybody can do if they suspect a problem but the customer passes his or her background check.
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by presluc View Post
    Perhaps we could have a system where preventitive measures could serve as well.

    Example say I live downtown D.C. and I walk into a store and say I'd like 5 sticks of dynamite any questions?

    This kid bought 3 guns and a **** load of ammunition and he lives in Denver ?
    What at 20 he decided to be a gun collector and bought the ammunition to look at?

    Maybe he had big rats, or maybe he needed protection?
    Or maybe just maybe some gun dealer was too busy counting money to ask.
    Did he ask for a red gun to match his hair?
    Realistically, like I said a while back, citizens willing to sign an affadavit should be able to flag people that seem to be very off, dangerously so.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Has anyone stopped to calculate the odds of being killed by a deranged gunman as opposed to, say for example, being killed by some idiot who is texting and driving, or who likes to drink and drive?

    It seems to me that the reason this is being made into such a big deal is not just the senselessness of it, or the loss of innocent life, as it is the rarity of such a thing happening.
    That's absurd. Do you ever pick up a newspaper and see the front page headline reading "man's grocery store purchase totaled 10.00 even," or "local woman tries to call son, dials wrong number which happens to belong to old friend." The big deal is that hundreds of people's lives were destroyed and there is no known motive. And frankly, there should be safeguards in place to prevent psychopaths from killing innocent people, when their actions clearly provide ample suspicion to justify action being taken. A 24 year old drops out of school, purchases three guns including a semi-automatic rifle, has all these things delivered to his apartment, then is rejected from a shooting range for sounding and acting like a maniac. That's fine? You can only buy sudafed once or twice a month, but what he did is fine.

    That's another part of why this is such a big deal. I'm sick of gun owners justifying the availability of any and all firearms. Can't we just agree that you can keep your guns and we can enact regulations that prevent them from falling into the hands of maniacs?

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