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Thread: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Furiounova View Post
    So you are saying when they were designed the goal was simply to shoot a projectile? That's it? That is an example of how gunners use intellectual dishonesty.

    You know absolutely nothing about my experience with guns and it is irrelevant to the discussion.
    That's it, you can use projectiles for more than killing. Full autos weren't designed to kill but they do have that effect if you are in the projectile's path and it hits a vital area, or if a tumbler hits you due to the barrel's rifiling. Do you know what full autos actually were designed for? Two things, 1) Rapid projectile deployment and 2)______________.

    Oh, and the only intellectual dishonesty was passing along that verbatim repetition of "guns were designed to kill" it was issued by the anti-gun lobby, who has zero functional knowledge of this topic.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Furiounova View Post
    So you are saying when they were designed the goal was simply to shoot a projectile? That's it?
    Does a gun do more than that?

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    That's it, you can use projectiles for more than killing. Full autos weren't designed to kill but they do have that effect if you are in the projectile's path and it hits a vital area, or if a tumbler hits you due to the barrel's rifiling. Do you know what full autos actually were designed for? Two things, 1) Rapid projectile deployment and 2)______________.
    And on a slightly different, but related point, assault rifles such as the M-16 were designed specifically to wound, not to kill.

    (Different assuming you mean the blank to be "lay down suppression.")
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    The Colorado movie gun attack just as the Virginia Tech killings will be a hard pill for America to take.
    The why's and how could this happen will be discussed long in the future.
    Then there are the N.R.A. speeches.
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    And on a slightly different, but related point, assault rifles such as the M-16 were designed specifically to wound, not to kill.

    (Different assuming you mean the blank to be "lay down suppression.")
    Yep. Killing an enemy soldier removes ONE from the battle, wounding removes at least TWO from the fight and requires expensive treatment to keep morale up. ;-)
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Yeah, I get that... well said, btw... but I suppose I (and others like me) are just not as obsessive about the "death" aspect. Possibly because we have no intention of killing anyone if it can possibly be avoided.

    I also have something of a passion for edged weapons, and own a couple of swords and several combat knives. These are really more "collectable" items than anything I have any anticipation of ever USING, other than practicing with them. I admire the workmanship, the lines and finish, the handle material and carving, the functional utility combined with beautiful craftsmanship. Yes, ultimately these weapons were designed to carve the guts out of another human being, and could be used for that purpose, but that is not my focus.

    Guns are a little different, since I actually use them for self-defense, hunting and target shooting. I am more concerned with functionality and less with collect-ability. Still, I don't obsess over their lethal purpose.

    Maybe I'm just less freaked-out about mortality in general? I don't know. Obviously there's a wide gulf in mindset here though.
    I'm just exploring the disconnect that often leads to premature judgment creating dialogue suicide. After publicized shootings the left wants more gun laws and the right wants more guns with both being too blind to realize they are out of ammo.

    I've been in your position except it was Chinese stars (even hand made a combo boomerang-CS) and scoped rifles and old hex barrel six shooters. It isn't about obsessing over the derivative purpose but only recognizing nothing can mitigate it and that is why AGs have a hard time believing gunners can also be intellectuals. Both groups need to realize mutual respect is the first order and without that, serious solution frameworks are impossible.

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    That's it, you can use projectiles for more than killing. Full autos weren't designed to kill but they do have that effect if you are in the projectile's path and it hits a vital area, or if a tumbler hits you due to the barrel's rifiling. Do you know what full autos actually were designed for? Two things, 1) Rapid projectile deployment and 2)______________.

    Oh, and the only intellectual dishonesty was passing along that verbatim repetition of "guns were designed to kill" it was issued by the anti-gun lobby, who has zero functional knowledge of this topic.
    Guns were designed to kill. Period. Claiming a different purpose reveals guilt in denial.

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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    I look forward to the Haymarket answer. I tried, in an ealier post to get it, but failed to get a reply.
    I think we begin to adopt a far more sensible and mature attitude about firearms. We look at them as tools - nothing more and nothing less. We put them in their proper perspectives and quit elevating them to the level of the Holy and the Perfect.

    That would be step one.
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    No offense but I think you're projecting your own bias onto these discussions to which you refer. You view guns as a negative, so you view discussions about guns in that same light.
    No. I simply look at them as a useful tool like a lawn mower or a good wrench. Nothing more and nothing less.

    Now let me make an admission here. I don't have much sympathy for violent criminals who engage in acts that could easily result in the deaths of innocents. I don't have a problem with armed citizens, acting in proper and lawful self-defense, killing armed robbers and suchlike. I've said so before and I stand by what I said. Perhaps sometimes I engaged in statements that seemed callous, like "one less scumbag is fine with me". Yup, I've said that.
    Nor do I have any sympathy for the devil. I support the death penalty and believe in flushing the toilet to get rid of the crap. We all say things from time to time to relieve the weight of our outrage.

    Now if you want to know my deepest thoughts and feelings on the matter, they're a little more nuanced. I've actually known a lot of criminals; in many cases I even found them likeable or felt a certain sympathy for them, if you ignore what they do... many come from really bad backgrounds and I often think it is a shame that their lives have ended up so fracked up.

    But my empathy for them comes to an end when they callously and uncaringly threaten the lives of innocent people. That's the "sheepdog" in me if you like; the sense that the wolves in human form need to be put down and their threat removed from the human herd. Some part of me may be saying "it is a shame this young man's life came to this, that he forced someone to put an end to him", but in the main I see it as the removal of a wolf from the fold.
    I would not disagree.
    Last edited by haymarket; 07-21-12 at 05:41 PM.
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    Re: Gun attack at Batman film premiere in Denver [W:120]

    Quote Originally Posted by dontworrybehappy View Post
    Does a gun do more than that?
    You can use it to make mashed potatoes. I was specifically talking about the design.

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