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Thread: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

  1. #171
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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    ok, i should have addressed that

    let's say his 2000 square foot facility was actually the game room he claimed it to be when he got the building permit ... and that he was absolutely within the code and zoning specs

    then, if he continued to hold his weekly Bible study classes (with an estimated attendance of 50) would he have legal sanction to continue despite the presence of lots of cars and non-residents in his community as a result
    As long as he's following the law I don't really have an issue. I imagine the parking issues might become a nuisance, but as long as they don't disrupt the flow of traffic I don't see an issue.
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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    But you don't have the right to violate zoning laws and city code to exercise any other right.

    Kind of like needing a permit to arrange a protest on public property, you know.
    I think a permit to arrange a protest is BS too, ya know. Permission to exercise my rights? On my own property? Seriously?

    I don't see none of that in the Constitution. I see unalienable rights, not granted by the Constitution. We see the mess everyday of what it takes to make laws creative enough to violate those rights, and somehow city codes are going to trump them?

    If thats what generations of supposedly great thinkers and politicians and lawyers could come up with, then you all are retards.
    “Tyranny is defined as that which is legal for the government but illegal for the citizenry.”
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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain America View Post
    Well, for one reason, the intent of the post was to compliment jamesrage and there was not an iota of malice or ill-intent in a single letter of it.

    Second, our mods are smarter than you might be giving them credit for. I would only imagine their response to your "reporting" was probably something like, "WTF???"

    But I do not like discussing the working of the forums or mod actions anywhere other than the "Where's My Binky" forum. I might suggest that you do the same or your "villiage idiot" comment may be the least of your troubles here. Just sayin'.

    Read the forum rules. Study them. Know them. And maybe you too will be here for over 6 years with over 10k posts too.

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  4. #174
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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    How idiotic. He wasn't jailed for hosting a Bible study, he was jailed for violating zoning laws. Yet another case where someone who is clearly in the wrong tries to play the religion card to get out of it.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  5. #175
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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokiate View Post
    This place is predominantly Mexican. If anything is getting stabbed, it's people.

    Completely and utterly racist and wrong to boot. The neighbourhood is upper middle class which as in most places in America doesn't mean there are no Hispanics but they are certainly a minority.With homes costing $500,000. Salman paid $700,000 for his place, I don't think you could the area "ghetto" or "barrio".
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    but let's say his property was entirely within building code compliance
    would you still believe it right to disallow his Bible study groups because of the crowd of cars and people it attracted to the community?
    What kind of group is entirely irrelevant. If what he's doing violates laws, it ought to be stopped.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    Michael Salman has been a problem for his neighbours for some time

    Here's a 2008 article, lengthy with a few facts that some folks haven't bothered to investigate for themselves. Some seem to prefer jumping on whatever their hobbyhorse might be whether related to a topic or not.

    Michael Salman wants to build a church in his backyard. His neighbors aren't buying it

    The real problem is that Salman is intent on building a church in his own backyard — and not just any church, but a 4,200-square-foot building that will sit only a few feet from his neighbor's property line.

    The North Glen Square neighborhood is just off the I-17, only blocks from the busy strip malls of Northern and Glendale avenues. But it feels worlds away.

    North of Orangewood Avenue, 31st Avenue narrows to two tiny lanes. Here, the houses are mostly 30-year-old ranches with a lived-in grace, some of them quite large. (Michael Salman's, for example, is a sprawling 3,147 square feet, with a five-car garage.)

    From the beginning, neighbors say, the Salmans were upfront about their faith ... But then Salman announced that he was planning to build a church right there in his backyard. He talked about not just Sunday services, but weeknight Bible studies, a workout room and basketball court, even a Christian day care center.
    April 15, 2011
    Pastor Michael Salman Files Federal Complaint Over Right to Hold Backyard Church Services; Phoenix Says Structure Violates Codes

    April 20, 2011
    Michael Salman's Fight Over Backyard Church Services Fails to Impress Federal Judge; Restraining Order Against City of Phoenix Denied

    This last one is funny June 2012
    Pastor Michael Salman Reports to Jail Over Phoenix Home-Worship Flap, but Gets Turned Away
    Salman is also the owner of Mighty Mike's Burgers in Phoenix, and he and his wife, Suzanne, run a credit-card processing company, as well. All that's in addition to his volunteer work as a minister for the weekly home services and the Harvest Christian Fellowship.
    “And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
    ~ James Madison, letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    What type of book the man was reading is totally irrelevant. He might have been reading the Kamsutra for all I care.

    He broke the Law. Period.

  9. #179
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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    What else would you expect from a city like Phoenix? It's in Arizona, before long, they'll start eating their own.



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
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    Re: Homeowner Jailed for Hosting Bible Study

    Quote Originally Posted by mertex View Post
    What else would you expect from a city like Phoenix? It's in Arizona, before long, they'll start eating their own.


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