• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2[W:1, 183, 386, 590]

Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

So I'm supposed to just sweep the truth under the carpet? Get real. NOTHING from outside the camp will encourage Republicans to compromise. That change can only come from within.

Truth? Explain to me how either not considering or rejecting 101 ammendments to the PPACA is encouraging or even considering compromise. Remember it takes BOTH sides for compromise.

http://rsc.jordan.house.gov/UploadedFiles/GOP_Amendments_submitted_to_HR_4872--8.31.10.pdf

Could it be that the change from within you espouse is more 'fall in line with what we want' especially when we are in the majority?
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

So I'm supposed to just sweep the truth under the carpet? Get real. NOTHING from outside the camp will encourage Republicans to compromise. That change can only come from within.

why should the GOP compromise? We saw what happened when GHWB compromised with the dems-taxes were raised and the dems did not cut spending as they promised and then, come november 1992, none of the dems gave GHWB any credit for compromise but trashed him as giving in.

The GOP should never compromise on tax hikes with Oblama
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

why should the GOP compromise? We saw what happened when GHWB compromised with the dems-taxes were raised and the dems did not cut spending as they promised and then, come november 1992, none of the dems gave GHWB any credit for compromise but trashed him as giving in.

The GOP should never compromise on tax hikes with Oblama

Can you be more specific? What spending cuts did Democrats allegedly promise and then renege on? :popcorn2:
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Can you be more specific? What spending cuts did Democrats allegedly promise and then renege on? :popcorn2:
What spending cuts did they promise?
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

As there is no way to estimate how many people will lose their employer paid health care when companies choose to pay their penalty the numbers above regarding costs to families and the government may both be understated.

Mere speculation. "Choose"? As in, they could actually obey the law and not take the penalty?
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

As in, they could actually obey the law and not take the penalty?

Yes choose...as in obey the law and provide health insurance OR pay the tax...
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Yes choose...as in obey the law and provide health insurance OR pay the tax...

Then we are in agreement. :)
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

What spending cuts did they promise?

That's part of my question for TD. :popcorn2:
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Truth? Explain to me how either not considering or rejecting 101 ammendments to the PPACA is encouraging or even considering compromise. Remember it takes BOTH sides for compromise.

http://rsc.jordan.house.gov/UploadedFiles/GOP_Amendments_submitted_to_HR_4872--8.31.10.pdf

Could it be that the change from within you espouse is more 'fall in line with what we want' especially when we are in the majority?

The law is, for all intents and purposes, a proposal created by Republicans. The main innovation that was attractive to liberal Democrats was the public option. In other words, the whole act was a compromise, and then jettisoning the public option was another enormous compromise.

Most of those Republican amendments were BS attempts to derail the process.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

The law is, for all intents and purposes, a proposal created by Republicans. The main innovation that was attractive to liberal Democrats was the public option. In other words, the whole act was a compromise, and then jettisoning the public option was another enormous compromise.

Most of those Republican amendments were BS attempts to derail the process.

Try peddling that, they got how many GOP votes in both houses again? The Dem mouthpiece is so desparate for political cover from this monstrosity that hes saying the GOP is responsible for it. That should tell you that they are not at all confident about the popularity of the bill as they purport.

So which is it? Its a great bill, like most libs have been peddling or its a terrible bill and its all the GOP's fault? Because you seem to want it both ways.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Try peddling that, they got how many GOP votes in both houses again? The Dem mouthpiece is so desparate for political cover from this monstrosity that hes saying the GOP is responsible for it. That should tell you that they are not at all confident about the popularity of the bill as they purport.

So which is it? Its a great bill, like most libs have been peddling or its a terrible bill and its all the GOP's fault? Because you seem to want it both ways.

 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

[video]http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Ffeature%3Dplayer_embe dded%26v%3D7-9v_3Flhos&feature=player_embedded&v=7-9v_3Flhos&gl=US[/video]
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

The law is, for all intents and purposes, a proposal created by Republicans.
Really? REALLY? Dude, I would love to hear you expound on this especially with some reasonable substantiation. I’m reading this as ‘if you don’t like the PPACA then blame Republicans because it’s their creation’…:lamo

Most of those Republican amendments were BS attempts to derail the process.

Maybe so but that doesn’t change the FACT that NONE of them were discussed OR passed. Compromise indeed…consider if the parties roll were reversed would you HONESTLY feel the same? 101 proposed amendments…
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2



that's gonna sting!

Did either of you watch the video? Mitt clearly states 'people have to take responsibility for getting insurance if they can afford it OR PAYING THEIR OWN WAY’. Does the PPACA allow for ‘paying their own way’ without penalty/tax?
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Really? REALLY? Dude, I would love to hear you expound on this especially with some reasonable substantiation. I’m reading this as ‘if you don’t like the PPACA then blame Republicans because it’s their creation’…:lamo

Are you seriously unaware of this? There's a good, brief history here: The individual mandate's Republican roots: A guide - The Week

Maybe so but that doesn’t change the FACT that NONE of them were discussed OR passed. Compromise indeed…consider if the parties roll were reversed would you HONESTLY feel the same? 101 proposed amendments…

Most of them were voted on and lost. :shrug:
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Are you seriously unaware of this? There's a good, brief history here: The individual mandate's Republican roots: A guide - The Week

So the Republicans came up with the mandate 'when they were searching for a market-based alternative to the government-sponsored, universal health-care system liberals were proposing'. Ok, now how does this equate to the PPACA being 'created by Republicans'? Or are you arguing that the mandate is ALL that PPACA does?...try again


Most of them were voted on and lost. :shrug:

EXACTLY my point...compromise....FAIL...:lamo
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

So the Republicans came up with the mandate 'when they were searching for a market-based alternative to the government-sponsored, universal health-care system liberals were proposing'. Ok, now how does this equate to the PPACA being 'created by Republicans'? Or are you arguing that the mandate is ALL that PPACA does?...try again

Sorry, but you need to try again to distinguish Obamacare from what Republicans previously offered -- including the Heritage Foundation and Mitt Romney. 'Obamacare' very similar to GOP plan | NewsChief.com

EXACTLY my point...compromise....FAIL...:lamo

Silly me, I forgot that when Republicans say compromise, what they means is "do exactly what we want and none of you want." :lol:
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Can you be more specific? What spending cuts did Democrats allegedly promise and then renege on? :popcorn2:

you deny that Bush didn't bargain for spending cuts? I cannot remember and you can google them as easily as I can. But Bush specifically demanded cuts and the dems failed to do so

Same with Reagan
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

you deny that Bush didn't bargain for spending cuts? I cannot remember and you can google them as easily as I can. But Bush specifically demanded cuts and the dems failed to do so

Same with Reagan

So you're sure ... but you can't remember ... and you want me to Google to support your argument? :lamo
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Sorry, but you need to try again to distinguish Obamacare from what Republicans previously offered -- including the Heritage Foundation and Mitt Romney. 'Obamacare' very similar to GOP plan | NewsChief.com

Why do I NEED to do the distinguishing? You were the one who said 'created by Republicans'. I asked for a substantiated explaination. The link you provided previously AND the one above primarily talks about the mandate and VERY little more. Try again…:lol:

Silly me, I forgot that when Republicans say compromise, what they means is "do exactly what we want and none of you want." :lol:

Funny, that sounds so similar to something I said…

Could it be that the change from within you espouse is more 'fall in line with what we want' especially when we are in the majority?

Plagiarism, silly indeed…try again…
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Why do I NEED to do the distinguishing? You were the one who said 'created by Republicans'. I asked for a substantiated explaination. The link you provided previously AND the one above primarily talks about the mandate and VERY little more. Try again…:lol:

Brother, the mandate is the lynchpin of the plan. It exists so that insurance companies can be made to accept people with preexisting conditions. That was central to the Heritage/Republican/Romney plan and its central to ACA. Romney also implemented health care exchanges in Massachusettes -- another lynchpin of ACA. Romney and Obama used the same consultant to help craft their plans. That consultant is on record as saying that they are the same ****ing plan ... and he used the F word. :lol:
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Brother, the mandate is the lynchpin of the plan. It exists so that insurance companies can be made to accept people with preexisting conditions. That was central to the Heritage/Republican/Romney plan and its central to ACA. Romney also implemented health care exchanges in Massachusettes -- another lynchpin of ACA. Romney and Obama used the same consultant to help craft their plans. That consultant is on record as saying that they are the same ****ing plan ... and he used the F word. :lol:

Let me see if I understand your point. The individual mandate IS THE lynchpin...but the exchanges are ANOTHER LYNCHPIN...seems confusing but whatever.

To further my understanding of your point, so the mandate IS THE lynchpin AND it was initilized by Heritage, etal so that makes them (Republicans) the 'creators' of PPACA...oh and since Romney inacted HC exchanges this further proves Republicans are the 'creators' of PPACA...but NO Republicans voted for in in Congress...doesn't that seem like a contradiction to you? Further since you espouse its greatness maybe we should elect Romney/Republicans since it is such a good idea...maybe they have others...?
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Brother, the mandate is the lynchpin of the plan. It exists so that insurance companies can be made to accept people with preexisting conditions. That was central to the Heritage/Republican/Romney plan and its central to ACA. Romney also implemented health care exchanges in Massachusettes -- another lynchpin of ACA. Romney and Obama used the same consultant to help craft their plans. That consultant is on record as saying that they are the same ****ing plan ... and he used the F word. :lol:

Hmm, so the thing going on with Catholic institutions, thats the GOP plan? How about the elimination of HSAs? How about elimination of numerous medical plans? How about the minimum floor for coverage where the penalty kicks in? How about the doc fix, that tore up medicare funding? How about all the tax structures that are set up? The 1099 minimum reporting? Are you REALLY saying thats all the GOP? Because I dont think so. They took the mandate, which was a neccessary evil of implementation and made it even ****tier in true DC fashion.

Again, states are the proper way to both establish a mandate and experiment with various laws and structures to find what works and what does not.
 
Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

Let me see if I understand your point. The individual mandate IS THE lynchpin...but the exchanges are ANOTHER LYNCHPIN...seems confusing but whatever.

To further my understanding of your point, so the mandate IS THE lynchpin AND it was initilized by Heritage, etal so that makes them (Republicans) the 'creators' of PPACA...oh and since Romney inacted HC exchanges this further proves Republicans are the 'creators' of PPACA...but NO Republicans voted for in in Congress...doesn't that seem like a contradiction to you? Further since you espouse its greatness maybe we should elect Romney/Republicans since it is such a good idea...maybe they have others...?

Hey, if you want to play at being obtuse you can do it on your own time. :)
 
Back
Top Bottom