Page 78 of 122 FirstFirst ... 2868767778798088 ... LastLast
Results 771 to 780 of 1220

Thread: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2[W:1, 183, 386, 590]

  1. #771
    Professor
    Billy the Kid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 02:29 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    2,449

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Honestly man, if you still don't understand, you just aren't even trying. Just really concentrate:

    Imagine that you buy a small SUV. Maybe it is built on a car chasis, but it has four wheel drive and in some ways looks more truck like. The dealership refers to it as a "car", but then when you go to register it at the DMV they say that because it is over a certain weight, they classify it as a "truck". You go back to the dealership and he says, "nah, it's more like a car". Is he "lying"?



    Right. The Supremes called it a TAX. The Justice Dept eagles argued it was a TAX. And I'm supposed to listen to how you want to word it by comparing it to a purchsed car. Sorry, I have to go along with the Supremes - it's a TAX.

  2. #772
    Sage
    teamosil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    San Francisco
    Last Seen
    05-22-14 @ 12:47 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    6,623

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy the Kid View Post
    Right. The Supremes called it a TAX. The Justice Dept eagles argued it was a TAX. And I'm supposed to listen to how you want to word it by comparing it to a purchsed car. Sorry, I have to go along with the Supremes - it's a TAX.
    I dunno man. I guess it's just too complicated for you. I really can't think of a simpler way to explain it than with that analogy. I think I've done a pretty decent job trying to simplify it down as far as it can go. If you can't even get that, then I guess we just need to let it drop.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

  3. #773
    Professor
    Billy the Kid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 02:29 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    2,449

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    I dunno man. I guess it's just too complicated for you. I really can't think of a simpler way to explain it than with that analogy. I think I've done a pretty decent job trying to simplify it down as far as it can go. If you can't even get that, then I guess we just need to let it drop.



    Not complicated at all. You're just trying some "smoke and mirrors".

    The Justice Dept argued before the Supreme Court it was a TAX, yes. The Supremes bought the arguement and ruled it was a TAX. Now you want me to believe that this "duck" is not a duck.

  4. #774
    Sage
    teamosil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    San Francisco
    Last Seen
    05-22-14 @ 12:47 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    6,623

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy the Kid View Post
    Not complicated at all. You're just trying some "smoke and mirrors".

    The Justice Dept argued before the Supreme Court it was a TAX, yes. The Supremes bought the arguement and ruled it was a TAX. Now you want me to believe that this "duck" is not a duck.
    Kiddo, seriously. You know why your claim is wrong. You must. I've explained it like 10 times in 10 different ways. Just pretending you don't get it is no way to win a debate.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

  5. #775
    Sage

    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    USA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    9,812

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Kiddo, seriously. You know why your claim is wrong. You must. I've explained it like 10 times in 10 different ways. Just pretending you don't get it is no way to win a debate.
    I didn't read the entire discussion - read enough to get an idea - but are you really claiming that this isn't a tax even though the government argued that it was a tax and the court agreed with that position and only allowed Obamacare to stand since the mandate was defined as a tax?

    I don't know how you could possibly explain that away well enough to make that true except to people that want to play games. Even Stephanopolis knew it was a tax. Obama looked like a fool during that interview.
    Last edited by buck; 07-01-12 at 08:32 PM.

  6. #776
    Sage
    teamosil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    San Francisco
    Last Seen
    05-22-14 @ 12:47 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    6,623

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    I didn't read the entire discussion, but are you really claiming that this isn't a tax even though the government argued that it was a tax and the court agreed with that position and only allowed Obamacare to stand since the mandate was defined as a tax?

    I don't know how you could possibly explain that away well enough to make that true except to people that want to play games.
    It is a fine in common parlance. Calling it a fine more accurately describes what it is than calling it a tax. That doesn't mean that the powers granted in the taxation clause don't enable Congress to do it.

    Like, here, what do you see as the difference between a "fine" and a "tax"? Seems to me that they're basically just two different spins on the same thing. Well, the taxation clause enables Congress to do that thing.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

  7. #777
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    This discussion has got me thinking...Would anyone find it useful if I created a website where you could estimate your premiums and subsidies on the new individual health insurance exchanges? It wouldn't be 100% accurate (since the health insurance exchanges don't go live until 2014), but it could at least give you a good ballpark estimate of what you'd be paying. I can build an estimator if people would actually use it.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  8. #778
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Last Seen
    10-20-13 @ 04:50 AM
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    3,195

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    that has nothing to do with having a penalty tax for not buying health insurance.
    Yes it does

    It's not a penalty and a tax btw. It's one nice big massive tax.

    Obama and the Democrats lied to you when they sold this turkey and passed it upon straight ideological hyper partisan lines against the will of the people.

  9. #779
    Sometimes wrong

    ttwtt78640's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Uhland, Texas
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    34,565

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    This discussion has got me thinking...Would anyone find it useful if I created a website where you could estimate your premiums and subsidies on the new individual health insurance exchanges? It wouldn't be 100% accurate (since the health insurance exchanges don't go live until 2014), but it could at least give you a good ballpark estimate of what you'd be paying. I can build an estimator if people would actually use it.
    That would be very interesting to see, especially assuming that the medical care insurance "base" rate would likely be very much higher in 2014, yet wages about the same. Will it include state of residence differences, income level, deductable/co-pay, payment percentages (e.g. 80/20, until X amount paid and etc.), age, smoking, single, married, and number of children (and whatever other things might matter under PPACA)? It would be interesting to also include the "fine" or tax if you "opt out" as well. Sounds like quite an extensive undertaking to me. Good luck. ;-)
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 07-01-12 at 08:55 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  10. #780
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Last Seen
    10-20-13 @ 04:50 AM
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    3,195

    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Kiddo, seriously. You know why your claim is wrong. You must. I've explained it like 10 times in 10 different ways. Just pretending you don't get it is no way to win a debate.
    Obama's lawyers argued it was a tax

    Supreme Court said it was a tax

    It's a tax

Page 78 of 122 FirstFirst ... 2868767778798088 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •