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Thread: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2[W:1, 183, 386, 590]

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    Is it what either side really wants? Does it serve the interests of corporations or the people, primarily?
    It's not what either side really wants. It's a compromise. The Democrats had to make a lot of concessions to the GOP/corporations. But they also managed to defend a number of things to benefit the people in there.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    So, more doctors, lower costs and less lawsuits are a BAD thing? Texans think NOT. ;-)
    A new study found no evidence that health care costs in Texas dipped after a 2003 constitutional amendment limited payouts in medical malpractice lawsuits, despite claims made to voters by some backers of tort reform.

    The researchers, who include University of Texas law professor Charles Silver, examined Medicare spending in Texas counties and saw no reduction in doctors' fees for seniors and disabled patients between 2002 and 2009. A 2003 voter campaign in Texas, and some congressional backers of Texas-style tort reform in every state, however, argued that capping damage awards would not onlycurb malpractice lawsuits and insurance costs for doctors, it would lower costs for patients while boosting their access to physicians.

    New study: Tort reform has not reduced health care costs in Texas

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by reefedjib View Post
    Medicare is based on that illusion. The government does the trick of borrowing the money to pay for the current deficit and drops an IOU into the Medicare account. It is all bull**** since like what 40% of the budge is deficit?

    It is clear that it is cheaper to do preventative healthcare to reduce catastrophic care. Stopping the federal subsidies for bad food would help a lot too. What a bunch of dumbasses, in bed with industry at the expense of the people:
    • fat causes heart disease? bull****, carbohydrates do. Reduce fat by eating more processed carbs...OOPS! Obesity and heart disease go up. Why did they do this? Corporate interests.
    • drugs are bad? prohibition is worse as we imprison 1.6 million on minimum sentencing felonies...and so on and so on...corporate interests
    • tax code...oh brother
    • financial regulation? Overturning Glass-Steagall and promoting mortgages to high risk borrowers, completely undermined the valuation of CDOs. Too bad the ratings companies were unregulated....corporate interests.
    • corn/soybean subsidies...corporate interests
    • and so on and so on
    LOL. The FIRST thing tha PPACA did was OUTLAW insurance companies from considering height/weight ratio (obesity) from raising premium rates. It also outlawed using gender, curiously it kept smoking and age. The bottom line id that gov't has NO idea how to assess actuarial risks in the insurance business, but it does know how to get (buy?) votes, by making "popular" laws.

    The SAME, 1500 calorie, lunch can be eaten by a desk clerk and a construction worker; the desk worker will get fat and the construction worker will get hungry. Obesity is NOT based on the source of the calories, it is consuming more than your burn, some of the rest is stored as body fat. Education about diet and exercise, not food taxes/bans, is the key to reducing obesity and other "diet" related health issues.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    It's not what either side really wants. It's a compromise. The Democrats had to make a lot of concessions to the GOP/corporations. But they also managed to defend a number of things to benefit the people in there.
    What specific concessions did House democrats make to the GOP that changed what they passed in any meaningful way?

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    That is BS. Requiring a male to purchase insurance for free BC pills or maternity care is simply a SCAM.
    No it isn't; the purpose of insurance is to spread the risk among a larger pool of people. What's a scam is charging some people more money for health care, for factors that are completely outside of their control (like being a man or a woman).

    As is requiring acupuncture be covered.
    Does PPACA require it to be covered? I dunno. If so, IPAB will study it like any other procedure, and it'll soon be phased out anyway since it isn't cost-effective.

    Many policies have VERY few exclusions, but have very high deductables. PPACA is LOADED with tons of mandates for useless stuff that must be "free" from dollar ONE, causing premiums to increase.
    If I'm not mistaken, the only things that must be free from the beginning are preventative care services...and that's a good thing. Although I'm all for catastrophic plans, there needs to at least be some free preventative care in there too. Otherwise, people will be less likely to see the doctor until it becomes a much more serious (and expensive) problem.

    Just what does SD NOT cover that you feel is needed in MA?
    I'm just using those states as an example of why buying policies across state lines wouldn't work, at least as it's structured now. I'm not referring to those states specifically, or any coverage specifically.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 07-01-12 at 04:49 PM.
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    It's not what either side really wants. It's a compromise. The Democrats had to make a lot of concessions to the GOP/corporations. But they also managed to defend a number of things to benefit the people in there.
    It is a big pile of **** on the floor, stinking up Washington, DC, America's toilet.

    The broader issues of unlimited federal power with entitlements and the inculcation of corporate interests in our government and the over-use of the Commerce Clause and no balanced budget and and and are all reasons that the Tea Party and the Occupy Wall Street folks ought to join forces. They are on the same side, as long as the Tea Party agrees to local, not federal, community care (education, welfare, unemployment, retirement and healthcare) and regulation of financial markets and reinstatement of Glass-Steagall, and as long as Occupy Wall Street agrees to local, not federal, community care (education, welfare, unemployment, retirement and healthcare) and a balanced federal budget. It is so easy and would be a significant political force.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
    What specific concessions did House democrats make to the GOP that changed what they passed in any meaningful way?
    Well obviously removing the public option is the hugest concession to the GOP and the corporations. Oddly, the mandate was another one. But also things like raising the caps on price increases.
    Total tax rates- People living in poverty: 16.2%. The median American: 27%. Working people who make over $140k/year: 31%. The top 1%: 30%. Super rich investors: around 15%. Help the democrats retake the house.

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
    What specific concessions did House democrats make to the GOP that changed what they passed in any meaningful way?
    Virtually the entire bill was the standard GOP idea for what our health care system should be, as little as three years ago.
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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    A new study found no evidence that health care costs in Texas dipped after a 2003 constitutional amendment limited payouts in medical malpractice lawsuits, despite claims made to voters by some backers of tort reform.

    The researchers, who include University of Texas law professor Charles Silver, examined Medicare spending in Texas counties and saw no reduction in doctors' fees for seniors and disabled patients between 2002 and 2009. A 2003 voter campaign in Texas, and some congressional backers of Texas-style tort reform in every state, however, argued that capping damage awards would not onlycurb malpractice lawsuits and insurance costs for doctors, it would lower costs for patients while boosting their access to physicians.

    New study: Tort reform has not reduced health care costs in Texas
    Costs may not have DROPPED in Texas but they certainly did not increase as fast as those in many other states did. Medicare spending in Texas is high because Texas has no state income tax and a warm winter climate making it a retirement and winter "home" for millions of yankees.

    Look for yourself at Texas medical care costs, compared to ALL other states:

    Health Spending per Capita by Service - Kaiser State Health Facts
    Last edited by ttwtt78640; 07-01-12 at 05:13 PM.
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

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    Re: SCOTUS LIVEBLOG - Obamacare Mandate Survives-Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    LOL. The FIRST thing tha PPACA did was OUTLAW insurance companies from considering height/weight ratio (obesity) from raising premium rates. It also outlawed using gender, curiously it kept smoking and age. The bottom line id that gov't has NO idea how to assess actuarial risks in the insurance business, but it does know how to get (buy?) votes, by making "popular" laws.

    The SAME, 1500 calorie, lunch can be eaten by a desk clerk and a construction worker; the desk worker will get fat and the construction worker will get hungry. Obesity is NOT based on the source of the calories, it is consuming more than your burn, some of the rest is stored as body fat. Education about diet and exercise, not food taxes/bans, is the key to reducing obesity and other "diet" related health issues.
    Of course obesity is based on caloric intake. But it is also highly dependent on the source of the calories. 1500 calories from salad is not the same as 1500 cheeseburger and fries. HFCS cannot be metabolically processed the same as fat or straight starch-based glucose. HFCS turns into fat and cholesterol much more readily. It is a systemic problem, involving diet (including caloric intake and source of calories) and exercise (a daily walk is sufficient). What are we doing letting the government, as biased as they are to doing a corporate deal, make these sorts of decisions?

    The same applies to actuarial risks in healthcare. Let the government collect the money. Let the industry allocate the resources.

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